Kingston Posted July 17 Author Share Posted July 17 3 hours ago, masster said: Not meaning to restart an old argument...but if Canada's 3 largest clubs weren't in a different league, the CPL would have better sponsorship and media deals to support better squad values that @jonovision was talking about. Except if they were in the CPL they wouldn’t be Canada’s three largest clubs, they’d just be three more CPL clubs drawing a few thousand fans at best and not attracting any additional meaningful sponsorship deals. You can have those clubs or CPL clubs - not those clubs in the CPL. longlugan, RS, Colonel Green and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil03 Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 6 hours ago, Kingston said: b) It doesn't really matter how long we, as fans, are willing to wait. It matters how long the owners are willing to wait. c) We, as fans, presumably won't be sinking anything, unless you consider those who purchase York tickets to be sinking their money into the team. In other circumstances, I would agree but as long as the CSB deal is propping the CPL I would respectfully argue things are a bit more complicated. Through that deal all stakeholders of the Canadian game, fans included, are making rather significant sacrifices to build up the CPL as a project. Its only fair to want to know where that money is going and that not only the direct interests of the CPL but also those of Canadian Soccer as a whole be considered when making those decisions... 6 hours ago, masster said: Not meaning to restart an old argument...but if Canada's 3 largest clubs weren't in a different league, the CPL would have better sponsorship and media deals to support better squad values that @jonovision was talking about. 2 hours ago, Kingston said: Except if they were in the CPL they wouldn’t be Canada’s three largest clubs, they’d just be three more CPL clubs drawing a few thousand fans at best and not attracting any additional meaningful sponsorship deals. You can have those clubs or CPL clubs - not those clubs in the CPL. And in a hypothetical median scenario where they manage, with the CPL giving big accommodations and making significant changes to its functioning, to keep at least *enough* of their current fanbases and media following to make a meaningful difference in term of media and sponsor deals, or at least to be able to recover from the damages of their conscription into CPL to be able to make such a difference eventually, odds are they'd dominate the league pretty utterly, monopolizing trophies and spots in CONCACAF for the foreseeable future. Since CPL clubs are fairly new institutions that don't have the built-in loyalties over generations of many clubs elsewhere in the world and North American sports fans are used to their clubs having a reasonable shot at a championship in the not-too-distant future having such a three-way Maple Firm would come with some significant problems for other clubs in term of building and maintaining fanbases IMO... Aird25 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masster Posted July 18 Share Posted July 18 22 hours ago, Kingston said: Except if they were in the CPL they wouldn’t be Canada’s three largest clubs, they’d just be three more CPL clubs drawing a few thousand fans at best and not attracting any additional meaningful sponsorship deals. You can have those clubs or CPL clubs - not those clubs in the CPL. I disagree. Plus, I never said if the Whitecaps, CFM or TFC were in CPL they would be as big as they are now. But since you brought it up...I do believe that they would be 'bigger', or at least in the range of Halifax right now. Which in turn would help the CPL as a whole. Montreal Impact's attendance in USL in the 2000s was higher than any team in the CPL right now. And that was 15-20 years ago! https://www.transfermarkt.com/club-de-foot-montreal/besucherzahlenentwicklung/verein/4078 I can guarantee that a CPL Whitecaps would be doing a lot better than Vancouver FC. CSL and USL history proves that. Who knows about Toronto, but I think it is safe to hypothesize that if CPL was the highest level of football in the city, York United would be doing better than they are now. To what extent is certainly debatable. I'm not saying that the 3 MLS teams should leave that league. What I am saying is that it is so difficult to compare the CPL situation to something like Sweden when the attention of the 3 largest markets and media centres is shifted elsewhere. Aird25, nolando and johnyb 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 5527 in Ottawa this weekend. I'm really liking the consistent over 5000 attendances Ottawa is getting. Kent, Kadenge, gwsmith63 and 7 others 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 8 hours ago, Kingston said: 5527 in Ottawa this weekend. I'm really liking the consistent over 5000 attendances Ottawa is getting. Kent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted July 23 Author Share Posted July 23 19 minutes ago, red card said: A bunch of Halifax fans were rocking TD Place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 On 7/22/2024 at 12:01 PM, Kingston said: 5527 in Ottawa this weekend. I'm really liking the consistent over 5000 attendances Ottawa is getting. Through nine home league matches: 2023: 42,437 / 4,715 average 2024: 45,665 / 5,074 average Through last five 2024 home league matches versus equivalent 2023 matches: 2023: 4,861 average 2024: 5,453 average The team averaged just shy of 5K in 2023 (4,948) and only averaged 5,368 in their final five matches which the team is already outpacing in July. Atletico could draw under 5K the rest of the way and still beat last season. If they average 5.4K for their final five matches they land at 5.2K average for the season. They had 7K out for their final match last year and I imagine they'll top that this season. Team will break 70K total in the regular season for the first time this season and should host a playoff match barring a huge meltdown. Bison44, Kent and Kingston 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aird25 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 Hopefully that pays for Manny and Didic nolando 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 Really frustrating and quite honestly bush league that there are still so many games with the attendance unreported. This is a screenshot from my spreadsheet and the cells that have text instead of numbers are the games that are still missing reported attendance. That's 7 games from the last 22 games that don't have attendance on the website. I don't think it's even necessarily hiding bad attendances, since 2 games are Forge home games and 2 are HFX home games. They should have decent crowds. Kingston 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 4 hours ago, Mihairokov said: Through nine home league matches: 2023: 42,437 / 4,715 average 2024: 45,665 / 5,074 average Through last five 2024 home league matches versus equivalent 2023 matches: 2023: 4,861 average 2024: 5,453 average The team averaged just shy of 5K in 2023 (4,948) and only averaged 5,368 in their final five matches which the team is already outpacing in July. Atletico could draw under 5K the rest of the way and still beat last season. If they average 5.4K for their final five matches they land at 5.2K average for the season. They had 7K out for their final match last year and I imagine they'll top that this season. Team will break 70K total in the regular season for the first time this season and should host a playoff match barring a huge meltdown. Before the season started I wondered if their improved roster would bring improved results and improved attendance. I'm glad to see that the answer is yes... although I'd be fine with them losing away to York United on Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted July 27 Share Posted July 27 Attendance for York vs Ottawa: 2019 Bbeto and narduch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted July 27 Share Posted July 27 Didn't take much to create a nice vibe at York. Good for them P-O, Ivan and jonovision 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted July 27 Share Posted July 27 York didn't have any matches over 2K the past two seasons (and would barely beat 1.5K) and now have two this season. Kent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted July 27 Share Posted July 27 The number seems good. It wasn't as packed as the home opener but still a decent crowd and decent atmosphere. My kid loved it but winning 4-1 helps Cheeta, Ftduck, P-O and 7 others 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted August 4 Author Share Posted August 4 I keep checking the league’s website, but there are hardly any attendance numbers posted recently. It’s disappointing, especially as many of them seem to be pretty good. Kent and narduch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted August 5 Share Posted August 5 1 hour ago, Kingston said: I keep checking the league’s website, but there are hardly any attendance numbers posted recently. It’s disappointing, especially as many of them seem to be pretty good. Only 2 of the last 12 games have attendance posted. I haven't updated my graph on year over year, week by week attendance because I have missing data from all except 1 of the last 8 weeks. The average from the reported games works out to about 200 more per game than last season, but I don't know how accurate that is since it's missing so many games this season. It's taking the fun out of tracking these numbers when there are no numbers. Any engagement with the league is good engagement. But this is becoming frustrating, and more work frankly to update my spreadsheet, because I end up checking the same games every week to see if there is a new number, instead of just checking them once and updating the number. Seriously, there are 13 games to check next week that should have already had data, plus the 4 new games. I'm starting to think I should just give up on updating during the season. Just wait till the season is over, update it then with whatever is available, and maybe again at the start of the next season to see if they finally have the 2024 numbers completely filled in. Kingston and Trois Reds 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonovision Posted August 5 Share Posted August 5 The Valour numbers are always included somewhere in the first few graphs in the post game writeup on the team page: https://valourfc.canpl.ca/article/match-report-valour-fc-2-forge-fc-1 3798 today. Not up on the match page yet. The story on the field has mostly not been great, but Valour's attendance has been encouraging. Closer to Cavalry's numbers than to the two BC teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted August 5 Share Posted August 5 2 hours ago, jonovision said: The Valour numbers are always included somewhere in the first few graphs in the post game writeup on the team page: https://valourfc.canpl.ca/article/match-report-valour-fc-2-forge-fc-1 3798 today. Not up on the match page yet. The story on the field has mostly not been great, but Valour's attendance has been encouraging. Closer to Cavalry's numbers than to the two BC teams. Thanks for that! You had me really excited for that. After checking that link, I checked another game I didn't have attendance for (a Forge home game) and found the attendance there too! But then the next 5 games I checked like this I didn't find anything unfortunately. I might continue looking another time, but it's time for bed for me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted August 6 Author Share Posted August 6 No number on the league website but Halifax reporting a sell out. So 6500. Bbeto and MtlMario 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted August 12 Author Share Posted August 12 3258 in Vancouver on Sunday That's the only game from this weekend with an attendance on the league's website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonovision Posted August 12 Share Posted August 12 3098 for Valour vs York. One of the smaller crowds this year. https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/soccer/2024/08/11/valour-fail-to-extend-unbeaten-streak-fall-to-first-place-york Kingston 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted August 12 Share Posted August 12 Some random on facebook in the Canadian Premier League Fans Club claimed 5813 for the Forge v Atletico Ottawa game. Grain of salt because he didn't cite any reference or where he heard the number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted August 12 Share Posted August 12 (edited) I'm calculating a league wide season average of 4040 per game with 1 York home game, 1 HFX home game, 2 Vancouver home games, 2 Cavalry home games, and a Pacific home game all missing. Plus I am using 10 numbers that haven't been posted on the league website. At this time of the season (70 games in) last year the average was 3714. That's an increase of about 8.8% if that 4040 number is accurate once all the missing data gets filled in. Edited August 12 by Kent Kingston 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonovision Posted August 12 Share Posted August 12 6 minutes ago, Kent said: I'm calculating a league wide season average of 4040 per game with 1 York home game, 1 HFX home game, 2 Vancouver home games, 2 Cavalry home games, and a Pacific home game all missing. Plus I am using 10 numbers that haven't been posted on the league website. At this time of the season (70 games in) last year the average was 3714. That's an increase of about 8.8% if that 4040 number is accurate once all the missing data gets filled in. Vancouver, Cavalry and Pacific have all been averaging below the league average this season, while a York crowd should likely more than cancel out an HFX one, so that overall average likely dips a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted August 12 Share Posted August 12 Here's a photo I took on Saturday. Count the heads jonovision 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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