Gold Cup 2023

[Kent]

6 minutes ago, cornerkick said:

Is there ever any chance of a Gold Cup being hosted by multiple Central American nations?  Like a joint Guatemala/Honduras or Honduras/Panama?  Or just having Mexico be the host nation?  Announce it 2-3 years ahead of time, allocate some funding for field upgrades if needed, etc. 

It's one of my dreams for this kind of thing to happen. Sadly all indications have been that CONCACAF needs the money that comes with USA hosted Gold Cups and they don't care at all about growing the event or giving a more competitive balance by moving the tournament around.

[JamboAl]

I think if a Gold Cup was held in a country other than the US, it would have to make sense financially for CONCACAF to do it.  Even holding it in Mexico wouldn’t work as what the charge for tickets is probably at least 10 times higher in the US vs what they would charge in Mexico.  
And as a reminder, there are now tickets for the Nations League Final in Vegas going for over $1,000 US each.  Even our deeply discounted Voyageurs tickets are $140-185 each when you include the service fees and exchange rate.  How do you compete with that?

 

[Kent]

49 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

I think if a Gold Cup was held in a country other than the US, it would have to make sense financially for CONCACAF to do it.  Even holding it in Mexico wouldn’t work as what the charge for tickets is probably at least 10 times higher in the US vs what they would charge in Mexico.  
And as a reminder, there are now tickets for the Nations League Final in Vegas going for over $1,000 US each.  Even our deeply discounted Voyageurs tickets are $140 each when you include the service fees and exchange rate.  How do you compete with that?

What does CONCACAF do with all this money from these competitions? Presumably it doesn't fund things like the U20 Women's World Cup qualification tournament (aside from paying the refs and some administrators I guess). It started today so I looked up the wikipedia page for it and I see that 6 teams out of 32 withdrew before the tournament started. I haven't looked up the reasons but I would venture a guess that a lack of money would be a big factor. So if these USA hosted events generate so much money, but Canada still can't afford friendlies or a meaningful youth program, and these 6 nations can't even send a team to a tournament they signed up for, what the heck are these mountains of money being used for?

[Matro25]

Would be cool to send a MLS based squad to this tournament Kinda like the US did a couple years ago.

If we win the Nations league with our A-team only though. If the boys can't get it done in Vegas I would like them to go for it in July. Bottom line is we need a trophy. We're past the the "good job" phase.

 

[gigi riva]

Love to see the Gold Cup  rotatating  from different nations not always in the States but unless CONCACAF  sees its profitable to do so,  it will always be held Stateside  whether we like it or not.  

[gigi riva]

2 hours ago, Kent said:

What does CONCACAF do with all this money from these competitions? Presumably it doesn't fund things like the U20 Women's World Cup qualification tournament (aside from paying the refs and some administrators I guess). It started today so I looked up the wikipedia page for it and I see that 6 teams out of 32 withdrew before the tournament started. I haven't looked up the reasons but I would venture a guess that a lack of money would be a big factor. So if these USA hosted events generate so much money, but Canada still can't afford friendlies or a meaningful youth program, and these 6 nations can't even send a team to a tournament they signed up for, what the heck are these mountains of money being used for?

Oh I am sure CONCACAF has got the money in offshore accounts either in The Cayman Islands  Dubai, or Switzerland  that Jack Warner and his gang set up many years ago 

Edited April 15, 2023 by gigi riva

[Watchmen]

5 hours ago, SoccMan said:

One game really why bother , just play them all in Houston then what’s purpose ? Here was I thinking all games at BMO for Canada oh well .

Well, pack the stadium then. If the game doesn't sell well, it gives CONCACAF an easy excuse not to send more games to Canada next time. 

[JamboAl]

6 hours ago, Kent said:

What does CONCACAF do with all this money from these competitions? Presumably it doesn't fund things like the U20 Women's World Cup qualification tournament (aside from paying the refs and some administrators I guess). It started today so I looked up the wikipedia page for it and I see that 6 teams out of 32 withdrew before the tournament started. I haven't looked up the reasons but I would venture a guess that a lack of money would be a big factor. So if these USA hosted events generate so much money, but Canada still can't afford friendlies or a meaningful youth program, and these 6 nations can't even send a team to a tournament they signed up for, what the heck are these mountains of money being used for?

Free food and free fanny packs in Qatar?  
Seriously though, using these large venues like SoFi or Allegiant Stadium has to cost millions in rent too.  And I’m sure CONCACAF subsidizes the smaller nations to a significant degree to travel around for these tournaments.  For example, going from Curaçao to Bonaire (20 min flight) ain’t cheap, and you can’t travel by boat either.  

[narduch]

6 hours ago, Kent said:

What does CONCACAF do with all this money from these competitions? Presumably it doesn't fund things like the U20 Women's World Cup qualification tournament (aside from paying the refs and some administrators I guess). It started today so I looked up the wikipedia page for it and I see that 6 teams out of 32 withdrew before the tournament started. I haven't looked up the reasons but I would venture a guess that a lack of money would be a big factor. So if these USA hosted events generate so much money, but Canada still can't afford friendlies or a meaningful youth program, and these 6 nations can't even send a team to a tournament they signed up for, what the heck are these mountains of money being used for?

Another example is the Caribbean qualifying for CCL. A lot of nations opt out each year

[blueseeka]

13 hours ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

Neil Davidson's scoop makes sense given the fact that we are in Group D.

We would likely play at BMO on Tuesday, June 27th.

BMO becomes busy again (Argos/TFC) in early July.

Damn only one Canada game. Very disappointing. Thanks for sharing

[RJB]

I'm sure concacaf has lots of questionable spending, but when you look at the nations in the federation, I expect many of them are subsidized. A country like St Lucia for example, or Bonaire, or any of those small population nations can't have a huge budget for international soccer. This is where the bulk of the money hopefully goes, to support these nations so they can participate in the national team and club tournaments that concacaf runs. 

[CanadaFan123]

Yes, I remember reading that most of the money goes to the smaller nations and that is one of the main reasons that we’re stuck having the Gold Cup in the USA. 

[Approve My Account Pls]

Interesting thread on Guadeloupe 'eligible' players:

 

[SthMelbRed]

What would a 9-point group stage do for our FIFA ranking? Could it push us into the Top 30, if we also win against Panama in the NL?

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

9 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

What would a 9-point group stage do for our FIFA ranking? Could it push us into the Top 30, if we also win against Panama in the NL?

I'm not sure, but we all want T&T or Guyana or Grenada to win the prelims, because a win against Guadeloupe will give us nothing.

[footballfreak]

It’s crazy how far T&T have fallen that they’re not even a lock to make a 16-team Gold Cup. Since the 2006 World Cup, they’ve only qualified to five of eight Gold Cups, and only made it out of their group twice. They haven’t won a Gold Cup game since 2015.

[Redpunkfiddle]

12 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

What would a 9-point group stage do for our FIFA ranking? Could it push us into the Top 30, if we also win against Panama in the NL?

Here are our possible point gains for CNL and Gold Cup, give or take- with some variability based on ranking point changes as teams win or lose over the next few months.

CNL SF vs Panama: +11.47

CNL Final vs USA: +17.30 or Mexico: +16.84

Gold Cup group vs Guatemala: +8.96. vs Cuba: +5.18.

vs T&T +9.86 or vs Guyana +5.00 or vs Grenada +4.76 vs Guadeloupe +zilch

Gold Cup QF vs Jamaica: +15.46

Gold Cup SF vs Mexico: +26.95

Gold Cup Final vs USA +27.68

Current ranking and points: 1442.66 (42).  The current 30th ranked team Ukraine is on 1530.04

Total points from matches we are favoured in (Panama CNL, Gold Cup group and QF vs Jamaica)  is about 53. That gets us to about 35th or so.  CNL Final and Gold Cup SF/Final wins push us up further. Total point gains from winning out is about 120, which gets us to 22nd or so territory.

USA and Mexico are on 1653 (13) and 1631 (15) points. It will take a couple of cycles of CNL and Gold Cup success to achieve that level.

Thankfully there are dedicated sites with ranking calculators and no longer need fingers and toes like those desperate days of 2019/2020 trying to figure out how to get ahead of El Salvador.

Edited April 16, 2023 by Redpunkfiddle

[footballfreak]

1 hour ago, Redpunkfiddle said:

Here are our possible point gains for CNL and Gold Cup, give or take- with some variability based on ranking point changes as teams win or lose over the next few months.

CNL SF vs Panama: +11.47

CNL Final vs USA: +17.30 or Mexico: +16.84

Gold Cup group vs Guatemala: +8.96. vs Cuba: +5.18.

vs T&T +9.86 or vs Guyana +5.00 or vs Grenada +4.76 vs Guadeloupe +zilch

Gold Cup QF vs Jamaica: +15.46

Gold Cup SF vs Mexico: +26.95

Gold Cup Final vs +27.68

Current ranking and points: 1442.66 (42).  The current 30th ranked team Ukraine is on 1530.04

Total points from matches we are favoured in (Panama CNL, Gold Cup group and QF vs Jamaica)  is about 53. That gets us to about 35th or so.  CNL Final and Gold Cup SF/Final wins push us up further. Total point gains from winning out is about 120, which gets us to 22nd or so territory.

USA and Mexico are on 1653 (13) and 1631 (15) points. It will take a couple of cycles of CNL and Gold Cup success to achieve that level.

Thankfully there are dedicated sites with ranking calculators and no longer need fingers and toes like those desperate days of 2019/2020 trying to figure out how to get ahead of El Salvador.

As things currently stand, we would be 12th in a combined CONMEBOL/CONCACAF ranking (bottom of pot 3).

53 points would take us to 8th and solidly pot 3.

Winning out would put us 7th and within touching distance of pot 2. 

All it would take then is Columbia having a bad start to World cup qualifying. Not exactly likely, but there is certainly a path to pot 2.

[SpursFlu]

Is it confirmed that the Copa America pots will be assigned based on combined Fifa rankings? 

[Jedi Ram]

15 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

Is it confirmed that the Copa America pots will be assigned based on combined Fifa rankings? 

With USA and Canada likely get A1 and B1 status as hosts.  So not sure why we worried about getting Pot 2 or Pot 3 at this point.  The rest of the draw would be based on FIFA rankings.  

[Jedi Ram]

22 hours ago, Redpunkfiddle said:

Thankfully there are dedicated sites with ranking calculators and no longer need fingers and toes like those desperate days of 2019/2020 trying to figure out how to get ahead of El Salvador.

Unfortunately there aren't one for CONCACAF rankings.  If we win it out, I would assume Canada takes a leap into Top 2 or closer to USA and Mexico.

[SpursFlu]

Are we talking about the same thing? I'm talking about the Copa America draw. So Brazil, Argentina then 2 more teams likely US, Mexico or Uruguay. Looking at combined rankings we're currently 9th. A strong nation's league finals and Gold Cup finals should solidify a top 8 and guarantee in pot 2 for the draw which could mean all the difference in the world as opposed to being in pot 3 or even 4

Edited April 17, 2023 by SpursFlu

[Kent]

3 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

Are we talking about the same thing? I'm talking about the Copa America draw. So Brazil, Argentina then 2 more teams likely US, Mexico or Uruguay. Looking at combined rankings we're currently 9th. A strong nation's league finals and Gold Cup finals should solidify a top 8 and guarantee in pot 2 for the draw which could mean all the difference in the world as opposed to being in pot 3 or even 4

I just checked what they did with the Copa America Centenario tournament which also had 6 CONCACAF teams in it, with USA hosting. Looks like they just put USA and Mexico in the top pot and then put the other 4 CONCACAF teams in their own pot, which would mean our ranking doesn't matter if they do the same thing again, unless perhaps we get to top 2.

OK, I actually just read the reasoning (and I hadn't noticed that Brazil wasn't the next best ranked CONMEBOL team). Here is the explanation.

"The United States (Group A) were seeded as host, while Argentina (Group D) were seeded as the highest FIFA-ranked team in the CONMEBOL region during December 2015. According to Soccer United Marketing, Brazil (Group B ) and Mexico (Group C) were seeded as they were "the most decorated nations in the last 100 years in international competitions from their respective confederations"."

So it sounds like CONMEBOL aren't above CONCACAF-like shenanigans.

[JamboAl]

The war wounds from the last 30 years have told me not to start figuring out which pot we will be in until we are actually IN.

[SpursFlu]

2 hours ago, JamboAl said:

The war wounds from the last 30 years have told me not to start figuring out which pot we will be in until we are actually IN.

Once victims of Concacaf shenanigans, we now ARE the Concacaf Shenanigans HAHAHA (that's my evil laugh)

Yah all good points but I'm feeling confident with a couple different paths to get in