Levonte Johnson

[youllneverwalkalone]

That's what Roberto Luongo used to say.

[footballfreak]

2 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

He lost his starting job to the naturally left footed Martins on the left when the team went to more of a back four (and also had their strong final push for a playoff spot).  They re-signed Martins and invested a lot in Gressel (who, when played as an advanced wingback, provided good service but much less so when played in a deeper, more central mid position).  They also, fwiw, traded up in the draft to get a French attacking midfielder.  I am not sure what the future holds, regardless of Sartini's public statements.

He’s not a wingback. He’s s a winger. He didn’t lose his spot so much as Sartini finally tried in vain to stem the bleeding from not having a proper 3 man backline. I also think Raposo suffered from having to move over to the left because we were so thin there. Plus he’s undersized, which is a running problem through the whole side. If he doesn’t fit the system moving forward so be it, but he’s proven to be more than capable of providing service in the final third. He needs to be utilized as a winger, preferably but not exclusively on the right, with some bigger bodies around him.

[footballfreak]

2 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

He lost his starting job to the naturally left footed Martins on the left when the team went to more of a back four (and also had their strong final push for a playoff spot).  They re-signed Martins and invested a lot in Gressel (who, when played as an advanced wingback, provided good service but much less so when played in a deeper, more central mid position).  They also, fwiw, traded up in the draft to get a French attacking midfielder.  I am not sure what the future holds, regardless of Sartini's public statements.

Re: Ngando, I view that more as a shot across the bow to Schöpf than anything else. The plan was supposedly to play him in an advanced position with Gauld as the 2 in a 3-4-2-1, but the dude was completely invisible on his best day.

[BearcatSA]

17 minutes ago, footballfreak said:

He’s not a wingback. He’s s a winger. He didn’t lose his spot so much as Sartini finally tried in vain to stem the bleeding from not having a proper 3 man backline. I also think Raposo suffered from having to move over to the left because we were so thin there. Plus he’s undersized, which is a running problem through the whole side. If he doesn’t fit the system moving forward so be it, but he’s proven to be more than capable of providing service in the final third. He needs to be utilized as a winger, preferably but not exclusively on the right, with some bigger bodies around him.

The one thing I agree with is that  his size is an issue.  He gets bounced around a lot more than the others without being able to draw fouls.  

Schuster also said that he wants to bring in a pacy winger, so he sees a role for wingers in the set up.

He has improved a lot, notably with dead ball service, but I am not sure that he has much more celing in his overall play where he would be a first choice starter on a playoff contender.  However, he can have a good niche as a squad guy for such a team.

[Unnamed Trialist]

Caps picking up Levonte J is a bit odd because you could argue the profile is similar to Lowell Wright, who they stuck in their Next team, with results that were not so great. I would have looked for a more finess attacker and tried to develop him better, or a wide player with speed.

Levonte and Lowell, strong strikers, powerful upper bodies, not necessarily that mobile, maybe technically limited. In any case, Levonte Johnson was described as a guy who bulls himself into scoring position. When that is not what Caps need, they need some quality to be able to match what Cavallina or Brian White can offer, in the air, one touch striking, playing with their backs to the defenders.

[footballfreak]

1 minute ago, BearcatSA said:

The one thing I agree with is that  his size is an issue.  He gets bounced around a lot more than the others without being able to draw fouls.  

Schuster also said that he wants to bring in a pacy winger, so he sees a role for wingers in the set up.

He has improved a lot, notably with dead ball service, but I am not sure that he has much more celing in his overall play where he would be a first choice starter on a playoff contender.  However, he can have a good niche as a squad guy for such a team.

He’s still only 23. Also he draws 1.69 fouls/90, so I’m not not really sure your eye and the stat sheet are in accordance.

[footballfreak]

24 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Caps picking up Levonte J is a bit odd because you could argue the profile is similar to Lowell Wright, who they stuck in their Next team, with results that were not so great. I would have looked for a more finess attacker and tried to develop him better, or a wide player with speed.

Levonte and Lowell, strong strikers, powerful upper bodies, not necessarily that mobile, maybe technically limited. In any case, Levonte Johnson was described as a guy who bulls himself into scoring position. When that is not what Caps need, they need some quality to be able to match what Cavallina or Brian White can offer, in the air, one touch striking, playing with their backs to the defenders.

He’s a late first rounder. You don’t select late first rounders with an eye to how they fit into your current squad. You take the best player available. Simon Becher was selected 16th in 2022 and played 8 minutes for the first team all season.

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, footballfreak said:

He’s a late first rounder. You don’t select late first rounders with an eye to how they fit into your current squad. You take the best player available. Simon Becher was selected 16th in 2022 and played 8 minutes for the first team all season.

That may be, but he was touted to go early and was the leading striker on the national champion. Fine, maybe some teams thought they could find other values, but I don't think anyone expected him to go so late.

I also appreciate they went for the highest rated Canadian not taken yet, to their credit. 

But he is not Caps profile, Wright isn't either, probably Ongaro isn't either. I would have preferred for the Caps to pick up an option on Terran Campbell a year, year and a half ago, because I think he is more complete player, however weakly used by Forge he has been.

[Cicero]

19 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

I would have preferred for the Caps to pick up an option on Terran Campbell a year, year and a half ago, because I think he is more complete player, however weakly used by Forge he has been.

Probably should be in his thread, but after watching him for a season I don't really know where Campbell should be playing. He's an okay poacher, but Pacius is better, he's got some decent short passing ability, but not as good as Borges and Choiniere and he doesn't have their dribbling ability. He's a mid-forward tweener that has to be in the right system to be used effectively. I liked him as a utility player for Forge, but I'm sure that's not where he sees himself.

[BearcatSA]

11 hours ago, footballfreak said:

He’s still only 23. Also he draws 1.69 fouls/90, so I’m not not really sure your eye and the stat sheet are in accordance.

I remember him drawing fouls in his own half  but I also noted that he'd get pushed off the ball cleanly when in possession in the other team's half.  But my eye sometimes misses the subtle analytics stuff, like how whoscored.com rated Alistair Johnston as the worst RB at the World Cup (and I thought he did pretty well for us within the context and nuances of the three matches)

At 24 atbthe start of next season, I am not convinced there is much more room for growth.  I was pleased to see him try more to take on defenders on the dribble 1 v 1 but his overall skillset is better suited as a depth guy/sub/rotational starter, and that's okay because MLS teams need those kind of valuable economical back ups.  

Levonte Johnson is also 24 at the start of next season, and the usual knock against NCAA guys has been that at these ages they might be "baked cakes," so to speak.  Maybe he is ready for the next level pro game or maybe he has more or less peaked.  We shall see.

[footballfreak]

3 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

I remember him drawing fouls in his own half  but I also noted that he'd get pushed off the ball cleanly when in possession in the other team's half. 

Given that he hardly touches the ball in the defensive third (20%), and given that he doesn’t get dispossessed very often (0.56/90 - less than Gressel, Cubas, Gauld) it is not at all surprising that you notice it happening more when he’s higher up the pitch - because that’s where he plays. He gets fouled 3 times as often as he’s dispossessed btw.

 

3 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

But my eye sometimes misses the subtle analytics stuff, like how whoscored.com rated Alistair Johnston as the worst RB at the World Cup (and I thought he did pretty well for us within the context and nuances of the three matches)

I haven’t consulted the whoscored article, but there’s certainly a case to be made from an eye test perspective that Johnston was Canada’s worst defender. He was uncharacteristically shaky and got absolutely torched a number of times - mostly by Perisic. Whether or not that deserves “worst right back of the tournament” is not really a conversation worth having to me, and certainly not germane to this discussion.

But you want to go eye test on Raposo - I did not see what you see regarding him losing the ball. He’s one of Vancouver’s most ball secure attackers, so its a weird thing to criticize about his game. If you had said he’s not great at beating players on the dribble, or he doesn’t do enough to create turnovers higher up the pitch, I would back you up 100%.

 

Quote

At 24 atbthe start of next season, I am not convinced there is much more room for growth.  I was pleased to see him try more to take on defenders on the dribble 1 v 1 but his overall skillset is better suited as a depth guy/sub/rotational starter, and that's okay because MLS teams need those kind of valuable economical back ups.  

Levonte Johnson is also 24 at the start of next season, and the usual knock against NCAA guys has been that at these ages they might be "baked cakes," so to speak.  Maybe he is ready for the next level pro game or maybe he has more or less peaked.  We shall see.

I don’t fundamentally disagree that a 24 year old has less growth potential than say a 15 year old, but I think it’s a mistake to consign him to a utility role for the rest of his MLS career. Wing players are generally most productive at ~26, which probably gives him 2-4years of growth in him if he follows a standard curve. All players are individuals and develop at varying rates at different times, but very few are fully cooked at 24.

An interesting comparison is someone like Richie Laryea, who turns 28 in January. In his his last season in Orlando before fizzling out, Laryea was as old as Raposo was in 2022. He played 325 minutes, scored 0 goals, and provided 0 assists. 2022 Richie Laryea turned out a little better than that. For comparison, 2022 Raposo played 1440 MLS minutes, scored two goals, one assist (roughly meeting his xG+xA of 3.19) on a team that struggled to create much of anything. We don’t know where 2026 Raposo will be, but he’s certainly not in bad company historically speaking.

With respect to Johnson and other older college players, I view the “baked cake” descriptor as more of a function of being unable to overcome the existing developmental deficit between college players and their professional contemporaries. A 24 year old Johnston will continue to develop, but he’s starting below the level of a 24 year old Raposo with his MLS experience. And every day Raposo continues to get MLS reps while Johnson sits in MLS Next Pro the skill/experience gap gets wider. So even though both Johnson and Raposo will both likely continue to develop for a few more years, Johnson’s curve will fall further and further behind Raposo’s if he can’t bridge the gap quickly enough to get MLS minutes. Most can’t bridge that gap. Or Raposo’s minutes could dry up tomorrow and his development could stall. But the developmental inertia is much harder to overcome for a Johnston than it is for a Raposo.

[BearcatSA]

5 hours ago, footballfreak said:

I don’t fundamentally disagree that a 24 year old has less growth potential than say a 15 year old, but I think it’s a mistake to consign him to a utility role for the rest of his MLS 

That's the word I was originally looking for.  Big engine both ways, can surprise with quickness in closing down opponents in the press, moves the ball quickly in attacking areas (but not a guy to consistently take on 1 v 1s when the opportunities arise), can hit a good inswinging cross on ocassion and has improved his dead ball delivery:  with those pluses, he'll help a team off the bench as a depth player and every club needs guys who can do that.

 

[SthMelbRed]

On 12/24/2022 at 12:15 AM, Shway said:

Doesn’t help when he plays for the Always Shitecaps.  

The majority of this forum will still get a boner for anyone from TFC, even though they've been significantly worse than the 'Caps for the majority of Raposo's short MLS career. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

11 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

The majority of this forum will still get a boner for anyone from TFC, even though they've been significantly worse than the 'Caps for the majority of Raposo's short MLS career. 

Raposo came through youth in Ontario in top of that. I met a guy watching Belgium-Canada who said he played with him, think he said Oakville. But unless they're playing in the 51st state for the American team on Lake Ontario, they don't count.

[Shway]

13 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

The majority of this forum will still get a boner for anyone from TFC, even though they've been significantly worse than the 'Caps for the majority of Raposo's short MLS career. 

I don’t know man, considering he’s a Toronto boy…I definitely rate him.

I mean no whitecaps fan would’ve thought Robbo would still be their most successful manager. Which was my “Always Shitecaps” comment. 

Has nothing to do with east or west, especially when majority of their Canadians players are from the east…

[longlugan]

Raposo is a Hamilton boy.

[spitfire]

5 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Raposo came through youth in Ontario in top of that. I met a guy watching Belgium-Canada who said he played with him, think he said Oakville. But unless they're playing in the 51st state for the American team on Lake Ontario, they don't count.

Raposso played for Burlington YSC in Ontario (Liam spent one season with him at BYSC before heading to England) But is from Hamilton I think

[RS]

New year, same board.

[Shway]

On 1/2/2023 at 10:20 AM, longlugan said:

Raposo is a Hamilton boy.

I probably assumed that because Patrice had told me about this kid “Raposo” on one of his teams. If not for Vaughan he wouldn’t have ended up at Syracuse.

But that’s besides the point. He’s still a GTHA boy 😄.

[masster]

Newspaper article from today on Johnson:
https://theprovince.com/sports/soccer/mls/vancouver-whitecaps/levonte-johnson-looks-to-add-to-blue-chip-soccer-resume-with-mac-hermann-trophy

 

[Big_M]

Signed with Whitecaps 2...looks like he really likes to bounce around...played for 4 colleges in 4 seasons in 4 states (Florida, Utah, Washington, New York) + Timbers U23 in USL2

https://www.whitecapsfc.com/news/wfc2-sign-canadians-amanda-johnson-johnston-re-sign-aguilar

[footballfreak]

Didn’t get on the scoresheet tonight but was involved throughout. Love his engine and how he just bodies guys. 

[Ivan]

Only watched the first half but thought Johnson, Coupland and Aguilar played very well. 

[Dominic94]

According to Sartini he will be with the first team in the Clash against York.. Wonder if we see Coupland soon, he’s killing it.

[narduch]