The Importance of the Players vs CSA Pay Dispute

[zeelaw]

Hot-take deleted

Edited February 14, 2023 by zeelaw

[Aird25]

Aren’t CSB responsible for securing these deals, and don’t many of them include CPL and League One sponsorships too? I thought the strategy was often to combine those rights 

[narduch]

One thing should be noted. Before the CSB deal the CSA used to make the same deal with IMG. Believe it was only $1 million per year though. 

A long time ago FIFA used to have a similar deal with Adidas. It's not uncommon for organizations like this to make deals like this.

[harrycoyster]

1 hour ago, Stryker911 said:

I understand that CPL is important and vital to long term success, but why is that the responsibility of our National Team players to help fund it? If so, they should be given some kind of ownership stake in the league.

Also worth noting, since our players are very clearly following in the footsteps of the US National Teams, that the USSF handed the American development academy over to MLS and stopped direct funding of the NWSL, redirecting those funds towards player salaries.

Asking for the money that is being used to prop up domestic leagues is in the playbook.

[Aird25]

Deleted

Edited February 14, 2023 by Aird25
Needless

[SpursFlu]

I'm interested to see a comparison of how much money our cwnt players make in comparison to a CPL team. According to the internet Sinclair makes 500k which is roughly equal to the entire wage of a CPL team.

 

Also most of the cwnt players play in Europe and their wages are subsidized by the revenue created by the men's team from their club

[Ansem]

 

 

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, Aird25 said:

Aren’t CSB responsible for securing these deals, and don’t many of them include CPL and League One sponsorships too? I thought the strategy was often to combine those rights 

We don't know the nature of the deals because no one will say. I'm sure there's definitely sponsors doing both (national teams and CPL), but how that money is used is unclear.

[Ansem]

 

 

[Aird25]

1 minute ago, Watchmen said:

We don't know the nature of the deals because no one will say. I'm sure there's definitely sponsors doing both (national teams and CPL), but how that money is used is unclear.

Not really true. Every sponsorship deal has been reported on. Gatorade for example.  https://canpl.ca/article/canada-soccer-and-gatorade-canada-introduce-new-partnership

[Ansem]

Noonan saying that some of the players on BOTH national teams directly benefited with individual deals like endorsements and appearance brokered by CSB (15:50)

The nerves....

Edited February 14, 2023 by Ansem

[Ivan]

2 hours ago, Stryker911 said:

Essentially what it boils down to is the players don't care about the CPL. And why should they? I understand that the CPL and CSB is important to our soccer infrastructure and our long term success. But why should today's players care about that? 

I don't believe, and it doesn't sound like the players believe they should be entitled to the sponsorship money, they wanted the FIFA payout. They aren't asking for a cut of Visa or Osmows money, but they probably want to see where all that money goes. Did it make it to youth camps or grassroots organizations? Or did it offset Forge's (Bob Youngs) salaries and Pacific's new stands? Why should CSB receive the sponsorship money and the FIFA money? 

I watched the clip on TSN with 3 other people that dont follow soccer at all. After watching the clip and the Beckie/Sinclair interview, they still didn't really understand what was going on and just assumed it was women complaining qbout not getting paid the same as men.

In about 2 minutes I explained that CSB made this deal where they gave Canada Soccer 3 million a year guaranteed, but they receive exponentially more than that now in sponsorship money and also apparently get FIFA payouts. So the players are left with minimal payouts and funding while most of the money makes its way to private clubs. They all immediately agreed the players are getting screwed.

I understand that CPL is important and vital to long term success, but why is that the responsibility of our National Team players to help fund it? If so, they should be given some kind of ownership stake in the league.

I also understand that CSB has put alot of money into this project. Great! Good for them! I am happy they did that. I am a fan of the league and want it to succeed. But if I was a player, man or woman, that has 0 effect on me. If I am Davies, why would I allow the CSB to make money on my jersey sales? If I am MAK why would I put up with insane racism to see Bontis party it up in Qatar on the back of my work. If I am any of those guys I am supposed to risk my body and livelihood playing in a Honduras swamp or Jamaican cow patch, to help a private company fund itself?

• Strange, before this clusterfuck, every player to a man stated we need our own domestic league to be successful.
• It's been reported numerous times CSB aren't entitled to the FIFA prize money and its not a part of their deal.
• CSB doesn't get FIFA payouts, the players will take the majority of the payouts including the women even though most of the prize money was earned by the men.  The women are complaining about budget cuts and prep cuts, not about money, so we are to understand.
• How do the NT players fund it?  By playing well so we get more sponsorships?  Players now get rights for the selling of their shirts after Davies' agent cut a deal with CSA.
• I don't understand the last bolded part.  How are they helping a private company fund itself?  The CSB are the ones going out and securing the sponsorships.  Why criticize them for making a good bet on themselves and our NTs, while of course, the success of the NT sure helped.  And like someone said earlier, this is not a $12-15 million profit every year (arguably the most ridiculous statement I've ever read on here, and that's saying something!) They run a league in which a team has recently folded and another has an owner threatening to if attendance doesn't increase.  Profit, I don't think is the right word.
• Everything else in your post not bolded I somewhat agree with.

[Gian-Luca]

55 minutes ago, Ansem said:

 

 

 Some points of note from Noonan from the video (though I encourage everyone to watch it - despite what some lunatic says in the comments on YouTube Andi does a great job IMO):

- Without CPL, there is no 2026 World Cup in Canada

- Confidentiality agreements in the contracts means they can't go around giving out what the numbers are

- The women were given a direct presentation on what the CSB is and does, so he is surprised that the women are still sounding uninformed, but also blames himself & CSB for not doing a great job of explaining what CSB is to the public

- they are looking into getting the Women's team a home game possibility as a CPL facility rent-free (my guess would be Tim Horton's)

- They are currently investing into growing League 1 into additional provincial markets and do want to speak with the Project 8 folks about the women's league, but also don't want to

- Reiterated that until this season, NSWL players were being subsidized by the national federations

- Individual players on the men's and women's teams have benefited directly from CSB brokering individual deals (endorsments and appearances) for them and have directly benefited (i.e. the money has gone straight into the players hands)

- Both CPL and CSB are losing money every year

Edited February 14, 2023 by Gian-Luca

[Ivan]

TSN with an article (written by Neil Davidson of course, Westhead would never ask the other side).

https://www.tsn.ca/soccer/canada-soccer-business-says-it-has-been-misunderstood-offers-to-help-national-teams-1.1919120

[SpursFlu]

I appreciate him trying to play nice but we all know the people he's dealing with are not doing so in good faith

 

 

 

Edited February 14, 2023 by SpursFlu

[narduch]

42 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Noonan saying that some of the players on BOTH national teams directly benefited with individual deals like endorsements and appearance brokered by CSB (15:50)

The nerves....

It's pretty obvious Larin is one of them

[SpursFlu]

I know I wanted a donair 

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, Aird25 said:

Not really true. Every sponsorship deal has been reported on. Gatorade for example.  https://canpl.ca/article/canada-soccer-and-gatorade-canada-introduce-new-partnership

I didn't say they weren't reported. I'm saying we don't know how the funding breaks down between the national teams, CPL, and L1.

[Watchmen]

38 minutes ago, Ivan said:

TSN with an article (written by Neil Davidson of course, Westhead would never ask the other side).

https://www.tsn.ca/soccer/canada-soccer-business-says-it-has-been-misunderstood-offers-to-help-national-teams-1.1919120

I'm sure Westhead probably has asked the other side. They are under no obligation to answer him. There's a difference. 

[SpursFlu]

Westhead is a hired hatchetman. He was brought in to upset the apple cart. That's his only objective 

[Ottawafan]

6 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

Westhead is a hired hatchetman. He was brought in to upset the apple cart. That's his only objective 

That is your opinion.  I quite like his reporting and exposing these issues.

[SpursFlu]

2 minutes ago, Ottawafan said:

That is your opinion.  I quite like his reporting and exposing these issues.

That's because you're brainwashed. If anything was framed up in the ideology you wish to believe to fill that giant void in your heart you'd believe 

Edited February 14, 2023 by SpursFlu

[Ottawafan]

4 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

That's because you're brainwashed. If anything was framed up in the ideology you wish to believe to fill that giant void in your heart you'd believe 

I am brainwashed?  How can you tell?

[zeelaw]

Probably just stop before this gets nuked boys.

[SpursFlu]

3 minutes ago, Ottawafan said:

I am brainwashed?  How can you tell?

Because you have your 10 commandments and you just go marching off the cliff

Edited February 14, 2023 by SpursFlu