The Importance of the Players vs CSA Pay Dispute

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

On 12/2/2022 at 9:59 PM, ted said:

Then you are not paying attention. This clearly shows that a proper working relationship, one built on trust and respect, is totally absent and endangers what the team has built.

The Chief Marketing Officer of the CSA should be on good terms with every player and able to at least get the players to acknowledge their existence. They shouldn't have to beg a player to do anything.

Players are not robots. Like you or I, in our worst moments, even the closest relationship we have are strained and affected. 

Have you acted the exact same with your significant other in every bad situation that has arisen?  If so, you are a much better person than I or have never had much go wrong.

These are young men in a gutting situation and - not shockingly- they acted immature.  They need to improve but an outsider passing judgement on the relationship with such certainty seems pretty silly to me.

Edited December 4, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[SpursFlu]

On 11/29/2022 at 1:20 PM, Aird25 said:

Or it speaks to players being disappointed about losing, underperforming, and getting knocked out of the tournament

Or it speaks to the relationship between the players and the media. Jonathan David Jonathan David we know you just got beat by Croatia in the World Cup but can you tell us what you think of the situation between Isreal and Palestine???

[Markoaleks]

FWIW- was on the Doha to YUL flight today on Qatar airlines - J David was on the plane and flew business class 

[Bison44]

1 hour ago, Markoaleks said:

FWIW- was on the Doha to YUL flight today on Qatar airlines - J David was on the plane and flew business class 

Tell me you got a picture!!!  

[Markoaleks]

Not this time 

I was back of the bus😃

[Bison44]

You werent in business class??  

[Free kick]

Deleted

Edited December 4, 2022 by Free kick

[Sal333]

On 12/3/2022 at 5:53 AM, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Players are not robots. Like you or I, in our worst moments, even the closest relationship we have are strained and affected. 

Have you acted the exact same with your significant other in every bad situation that has arisen?  If so, you are a much better person than I or have never had much go wrong.

These are young men in a gutting situation and - not shockingly- they acted immature.  They need to improve but an outsider to passing judgement on the relationship with such certainty seems pretty silly to me.

You're in the UK so you may have missed it but TSN talked to De Guzman about the situation between the NT players and the CSA (and also CSB).

Firstly, I noticed Guzman did everything on TV except spit to display his disgust for both those organizations.

Secondly, he came out and flatly said the players don't trust the CSA or CSB.

Thirdly and the most damning, James Duthie said they didn't have Janine Beckie on the panel because it would compromise her position. I wonder what stories she had to say.

There's a serious rift between the CSA and the NT players and it was on display fr all of Canada to see.

 

 

 

 

[scooterlawrence5]

FACT 1: JdG is part owner of a League 1 club. CSB owns League 1. Ergo, he cut up his own partner. 

 

FACT 2: JdG is an NT alumnus. A registered voting member of the CSA is NT alumni. Ergo, he cut up his own association.

 

He has an important "seat at both tables". Offering solutions to help grow our sport on national TV would have been the better alternative than a rant.

 

We need to get beyond the divisiveness. Given his roles, JdG has a major responsibility to our sport that he chose to renege on.

 

[Gian-Luca]

4 minutes ago, scooterlawrence5 said:

FACT 1: JdG is part owner of a League 1 club. CSB owns League 1. Ergo, he cut up his own partner. 

 

FACT 2: JdG is an NT alumnus. A registered voting member of the CSA is NT alumni. Ergo, he cut up his own association.

 

He has an important "seat at both tables". Offering solutions to help grow our sport on national TV would have been the better alternative than a rant.

 

We need to get beyond the divisiveness. Given his roles, JdG has a major responsibility to our sport that he chose to renege on.

 

His rant was awful and came across as incredibly biased as someone who had been known to bash the CPL before. He basically pretended that the CPL doesn’t exist, other than when he said it was ridiculous that the CSB money was being used to help pay professional players, though he never mentioned the CPL by name. Otherwise, he claimed that the CSA needs to do more for player development because the 3 MLS clubs can’t do it alone and also claimed that there is no clear developmental pathway or pyramid for players in Canada to get to the pro ranks, as though the CPL doesn’t exist (or even League 1 for that matter). All this with two former CPL players on the World Cup roster and another one who was in Qatar training with the team and helping them to prepare.

Too bad TSN didn’t invite Josh Simpson to the panel even though he was in Qatar, I would have liked to have seen Josh refute De Guzman’s claims and points rather than the one-sided hatchet job they broadcast.

[Sal333]

12 minutes ago, scooterlawrence5 said:

FACT 1: JdG is part owner of a League 1 club. CSB owns League 1. Ergo, he cut up his own partner. 

 

FACT 2: JdG is an NT alumnus. A registered voting member of the CSA is NT alumni. Ergo, he cut up his own association.

 

He has an important "seat at both tables". Offering solutions to help grow our sport on national TV would have been the better alternative than a rant.

 

We need to get beyond the divisiveness. Given his roles, JdG has a major responsibility to our sport that he chose to renege on.

 

That's one way to look at it.

Another way, he has had so much bad experience with those two groups (CSA & CSB) that he is at his wit's end and decided to reveal a little of what he knows.

 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

2 hours ago, Sal333 said:

You're in the UK so you may have missed it but TSN talked to De Guzman about the situation between the NT players and the CSA (and also CSB).

Firstly, I noticed Guzman did everything on TV except spit to display his disgust for both those organizations.

Secondly, he came out and flatly said the players don't trust the CSA or CSB.

Thirdly and the most damning, James Duthie said they didn't have Janine Beckie on the panel because it would compromise her position. I wonder what stories she had to say.

There's a serious rift between the CSA and the NT players and it was on display fr all of Canada to see.

I think you have lost the thread a little, I never said anything about the relationship. I just essentially said there is nothing to say reactions in highly charged emotional moment mean anything about other issues.

None of the things you mention are young players' reactions to attempts at interviews when they have played poorly and have just been eliminated from a competition  You see such immaturity in all sports I watch, at club or international level, no matter what their relationship with their organization. So not really evidence of anything else to me.

Also confused why when a number of posters agreed that making the connection was a reach, one poster decided to single out my short comment.  I thought it was a bit silly to jump like that so tried explain how I think how some people react regardless of their relationships.  You then commented on something I have never mentioned - the general state of the relationship.

Edited December 4, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[Sal333]

7 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

I think you have lost the thread a little, I never said anything about the relationship. I just essentially said there is nothing to say reactions in highly charged emotional moment mean anything about other issues.

None of the things you mention are young players' reactions to attempts at interviews when they have played poorly and have just been eliminated from a competition  You see such immaturity in all sports I watch, at club or international level, no matter what their relationship with their organization. So not really evidence of anything else to me.

Also confused why when a number of posters agreed that making the connection was a reach, one poster decided to single out my short comment.  I thought it was a bit silly to jump like that so tried explain how I think how some people react regardless of their relationships.  You then commented on something I have never mentioned - the general state of the relationship.

Sorry. I wasn't directing the post at you. I was using your post as a jumping off point.

[Ruud]

Wonder how the women’s recent announcement brings in (or not) the CPL!  

[Ruud]

Clearly Kerfoot is behind a team.  So that brings one MLS side on board.  

[narduch]

Isn't Cavalry and Foothills the same group?

[Aird25]

1 hour ago, Ruud said:

Wonder how the women’s recent announcement brings in (or not) the CPL!  

I presume both leagues need the same type of things to be successful (ie. owners, facilities, sponsorships, sanctioning, media etc.). I don't get why our landscape always needs to be so fractured, when a bit of cooperation would likely help all involved.

Edited December 6, 2022 by Aird25

[VinceA]

2 hours ago, narduch said:

Isn't Cavalry and Foothills the same group?

No they just have a working relationship.

[Ruud]

12 hours ago, Aird25 said:

I presume both leagues need the same type of things to be successful (ie. owners, facilities, sponsorships, sanctioning, media etc.). I don't get why our landscape always needs to be so fractured, when a bit of cooperation would likely help all involved.

Full marks to Matheson for her “build it and they will come “ mentality and for AC and CIBC for committing early.  But I would have expected she had approached CPL or given them a chance to join in at the outset.  Now it looks like teams are on the outside looking in. 

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

18 hours ago, Ruud said:

Clearly Kerfoot is behind a team.  So that brings one MLS side on board.  

Can't imagine he was thrilled about the recently revealed Vancouver FC branding and it remains to be seen if a CanPL owner can do something in Canada separate from CSB where pro soccer is concerned. CanPL has done diddlysquat so far about launching a women's pro league despite being handed CWNT marketing revenues by Victor Montagliani when CSB was formed but have made vague statements about doing it eventually.

Looks like key women's national team figures got fed up with the patriarchy where the CSA and CSB are concerned and decided to go for a sisters are doing it for themselves sort of approach. Completely understandable under the circumstances given the way that even pursuing an NWSL approach may have been compromised by the emergence of CanPL and its stated goal of eventually forming a women's league.

Edited December 7, 2022 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[narduch]

I have stated before that I think the dispute is essentially over already.

They will quietly sign a deal in early 2023 and move on.

The proof of this is the players taking part in commercials (new Gatorade ad, Larin Osmow ad, etc).

Some people on this board seem to want to still sensationalize this when there is no reason too

 

 

[Aird25]

44 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Can't imagine he was thrilled about the recently revealed Vancouver FC branding and it remains to be seen if a CanPL owner can do something in Canada separate from CSB where pro soccer is concerned. CanPL has done diddlysquat so far about launching a women's pro league despite being handed CWNT marketing revenues by Victor Montagliani when CSB was formed but have made vague statements about doing it eventually.

Looks like key women's national team figures got fed up with the patriarchy where the CSA and CSB are concerned and decided to go for a sisters are doing it for themselves sort of approach. Completely understandable under the circumstances given the way that even pursuing an NWSL approach may have been compromised by the emergence of CanPL and its stated goal of eventually forming a women's league.

Last I checked, some of the CPL owners literally represented our country in pro soccer. Aren't there now women's L1Canada, L1O, PLSQ, and L1BC teams?

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

^^^clearly doesn't know who bought L1O back in 2018.

 

[Watchmen]

27 minutes ago, Aird25 said:

Last I checked, some of the CPL owners literally represented our country in pro soccer. Aren't there now women's L1Canada, L1O, PLSQ, and L1BC teams?

I'm not going to follow Ozzie down that path, but I do think people need to stop giving the CPL credit for things the L1s are doing. They've largely been set up and run independently of anything CPL related. 

[Aird25]

4 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

I'm not going to follow Ozzie down that path, but I do think people need to stop giving the CPL credit for things the L1s are doing. They've largely been set up and run independently of anything CPL related. 

I would be interested to see more on the credit CPL is getting for the L1s. I haven't stumbled across any of that yet. Any chance you could you link me to the conversation?