narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, Free kick said: they (CSA) got $3 mill from CSB. CSB turned around flipped those rights to Bell media. The people who are delusional are those who think that those rights would NOT be worth much much more than that for the WCQ run. What are you talking about here? This doesn`t even make any sense. I think the CSB deal was handled poorly but to argue that the rights to broadcast CanMNT had any value in 2018 is revisionist history. I will argue that CSB only started to become profitable in November of 2021. Edited October 22, 2022 by narduch PegCityCam, red card, johnyb and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 3 hours ago, jonovision said: The journalist is paid by the World Cup broadcast rights holder. His bosses have no vested interest in making Canada soccer look bad. Bad press sells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 48 minutes ago, narduch said: What are you talking about here? This doesn`t even make any sense. I think the CSB deal was handled poorly but to argue that the rights to broadcast CanMNT had any value in 2018 is revisionist history. I will argue that CSB only started to become profitable in November of 2021. I am not talking about 2018 when they signed the deal with CSB! I am talking about 2020 when Canada was playing in ocho and CSA could not spinoff that new viewership into a windfall. ALSO, you have no idea (nor anyone else here) what Bell media or Rogers would have paid in 2018. Thats all anecdotal. But that's besides my point because what counts here is that those rights got flipped from 3mill to something else. And in the media rights business, nothing is worth as low as 3 mil. Edited October 22, 2022 by Free kick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 4 minutes ago, Free kick said: I am not talking about 2018 when they signed the deal with CSB. I am talking about 2020 when canada was playing in ocho and CSA could not spinoff that new viewership into a windfall Ok but you have details wrong. Which hurts your argument Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, narduch said: Ok but you have details wrong. No I dont Edited October 22, 2022 by Free kick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Free kick said: No I dont Mediapro (not CSB) gave the Octagonal matches to Sportsnet (not Bell). I believe they weren't even paid for it. They broadcast them for free So its not this lucrative deal you are trying to make it out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 minute ago, narduch said: Mediapro (not CSB) gave the Octagonal matches to Sportsnet (not Bell). I believe they weren't even paid for it. They broadcast them for free So its not this lucrative deal you are trying to make it out to be. Ok. its Rogers. I will edit my post to chnage Bell to rogers. But my point stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, Free kick said: Ok. its Rogers. I will edit my post to chnage Bell to rogers. But my point stand. CSB and Media Pro are different companies. So you are still wrong. You think Rogers paid millions to show those 13 matches? Lmfao Edited October 22, 2022 by narduch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, narduch said: So you are still wrong. I give up. !!!!! You are just too closed minded. Just read my posts and links again. You will see that even for niche sport like F1, in the US (a market 10 times the size of Canada) the media rights fetched 90 Million /year in 2020. What does project for in Canada in 2020? do the math. Edited October 22, 2022 by Free kick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 7 minutes ago, narduch said: I believe they weren't even paid for it. They broadcast them for free. Why do you think that is the case? Free kick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Free kick said: I give up. !!!!! You are just too closed minded. Just read my posts and links. You will see that even for niche sport like F1, in the US (a market 10 times the size of Canada) the media rights fetched 90 Million for a year in 2020. What does project for in Canada in 2020. Are you really comparing F1 rights in the US to CanMNT rights? You do know that F1 is on the rise thanks to the Netflix show about it? The US has an active Streaming service rights battle as well. We don't have the same thing in Canada. Come on man. Just take the L and move on PegCityCam, ag futbol, red card and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 41 minutes ago, narduch said: CSB and Media Pro are different companies. You confused!!...Of course they are different companies! read again. I dont know what this has to do with what i said. edit.: OK i see what you mean now. Its media pro who flipped those rights. But again, the main point stands. CSA received 3 Mill for something that may have conservatively been worth 7-15 Million in 2020 based on projections from the articles from forbes. edit#2.: since mediapro and CSB are both private companies we dont know the details of what each got in that deal with Rogers. Edited October 22, 2022 by Free kick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, Free kick said: You confused!!...Of course they are different companies! read again. I dont know what this has to do with what i said. If you have all your facts wrong how am I supposed to take your greater point seriously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meepmeep Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 2 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said: He also thinks an enterprise investing 120 million in Canada is taking bags of profits in back to Spain, I suppose in the form of bullion on the Santa Maria or one of those other caravels Columbus used to suck the blood out of Canadian soccer. We have a whole thread on tv ratings for the CNMT games. It's a sad and pointless thread because CSB gave exclusive broadcast rights to Media pro for 10 years...10 years!! So the ratings are meaningless to the federation and to us the fans. Any increased ad revenue goes to Mediapro and there is no posssibility for the Federation to gain a windfall from the increased viewership Unnamed Trialist and PegCityCam 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 12 minutes ago, Metro said: Why do you think that is the case? Pretty sure it was mentioned on one of the podcasts (Northern Futbol or Footy Prime). The deal was for no money. They basically just gave them the time slot. Its also part of the reason why it was only a simulcast of the One Soccer feed. Rogers put zero money into it PegCityCam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, narduch said: Pretty sure it was mentioned on one of the podcasts (Northern Futbol or Footy Prime). The deal was for no money. They basically just gave them the time slot. Its also part of the reason why it was only a simulcast of the One Soccer feed. Rogers put zero money into it Ok, cool. Not sure they’re right; it wouldn’t make sense. Just speculating, but the games should have had had value at the time of the Agreement, especially the Mexico and USA games. Also it was MediaPro negotiating, not the CSA. 😄 narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) And I think TSN kinda pulled a quick one broadcasting the v US games based on the fact they're owned by espn and their deal with US Soccer. I stand to be corrected and all fare in love and war but that kinda shows where everyone's at in these relationships Edited October 22, 2022 by SpursFlu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonovision Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 32 minutes ago, SpursFlu said: And I think TSN kinda pulled a quick one broadcasting the v US games based on the fact they're owned by espn and their deal with US Soccer. I stand to be corrected and all fare in love and war but that kinda shows where everyone's at in these relationships Well, if you are standing to be corrected, here's one: TSN only broadcast the match away to the US. The home match was a OneSoccer production aired on Sportsnet like all others. Edited October 22, 2022 by jonovision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, jonovision said: Well, if you are standing to be corrected, here's one: TSN only broadcast the match away to the US. The home match was a OneSoccer production aired on Sportsnet like all others. Ok sure but that's what I meant. Because it was a US home game they had regional rights blah blah blah I'm speculating but it seems TSN wasn't willing to pay 1 cent for qualifying games Edited October 22, 2022 by SpursFlu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonovision Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 7 minutes ago, SpursFlu said: Ok sure but that's what I meant. Because it was a US home game they had regional rights blah blah blah I'm speculating but it seems TSN wasn't willing to pay 1 cent for qualifying games I don't think there's any grand conspiracy here. I don't think Sportsnet had to bid a lot to get all of the matches off the hop. If TSN believed there was money to be made they would have made a better bid. Bad business sense, and not foreseeing a historic run. narduch and RS 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 5 hours ago, Free kick said: they (CSA) got $3 mill from CSB. CSB turned around flipped those rights to Rogers media. The people who are delusional are those who think that those rights would NOT be worth much much much more than that (for the WCQ run). Expect TV Rights Fees For Sports To Soar (forbes.com) Media Rights Fees For Lower Rated Sports Are Soaring - Forbes | Canada News Media and none of those has anything to do with argument you try to present. Try Again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 Rogers offset some of OneSoccer's production costs in order to simulcast Canada's WCQ. TSN pays Hockey Canada $15 million/yr where Hockey Canada owns various events including one of TSN's marquee events, the World Juniors. 3 Canadian MLS teams with 8 months of matches got $15 million from TSN/TVA. CFL gets $40 million. Canada Soccer isn't anywhere near these properties as it barely has an inventory of 10 M/W matches/yr to offer and doesn't own the rights to World Cup, Gold Cup, Olympics or international friendlies/WCQ. If you haven't noticed, Bell/Rogers have put all their media divisions in cost cutting mode. Layoffs have been happening for years. Most channels are 80% repeats or zombie channels. TSN2 is the first Cdn sports zombie channel. Tier 2 Canadian-based sports orgs largely now get on TSN by sharing ad revenue and hoping ratings become good enough down the line that TSN may pay for the rights. Montagliani has taken TSN/SN to the woodshed for their lack of support. Canada Soccer financials in most recent years don't have a separate line item for sponsorships. It's bundled under Commercial & other fees which has included services & goods in-kind, covid relief and international tv rights. The 2015 report did list $8.5 million for sponsorships & donations (WWC 15 being the main contributor as major sponsors like Bell & BMO signed on for the tourney). PegCityCam, Metro, DoyleG and 4 others 5 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 14 minutes ago, jonovision said: I don't think there's any grand conspiracy here. I don't think Sportsnet had to bid a lot to get all of the matches off the hop. If TSN believed there was money to be made they would have made a better bid. Bad business sense, and not foreseeing a historic run. Yah no grand conspiracy or grudge held by TSN towards Canadian Soccer. Just The right holders of the World Cup TSN, being complete idiots. Ok fine ill go with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 29 minutes ago, jonovision said: Well, if you are standing to be corrected, here's one: TSN only broadcast the match away to the US. The home match was a OneSoccer production aired on Sportsnet like all others. 20 minutes ago, jonovision said: I don't think there's any grand conspiracy here. I don't think Sportsnet had to bid a lot to get all of the matches off the hop. If TSN believed there was money to be made they would have made a better bid. Bad business sense, and not foreseeing a historic run. Following one side of this conversation. You are correct. I’ll add: The one WCQ game from last cycle that aired on TSN in Canada was produced and broadcast in the U.S. by FS1 (ESPN’s main competitor). jonovision 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 (edited) But did TSN make a bid? I thought at the time they didn't want to even have a conversation. So the point wasn't about the specific details.. the point was TSN clearly doesn't want anything to do with Onesoccer, media pro and are not playing nice with the CSA or any of their initiatives. They clearly liked having the CSA over a barrel for years. For anyone to suggest that there was no value in airing the World Cup qualifiers is pretty comical considering their performance leading up to it and the emergence of Davies and David. Yah it was such a dead property that the final few games TSN would cut to a live post game show with full analysis for 30 mins +. They clearly have a bug up their ass and wouldnt give the CSA a nickle to save their lives. People seem willing to say whatever for sake of argument Edited October 23, 2022 by SpursFlu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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