CANCELLED WC Prep Match #1: Canada vs Panama- Sunday, June 5 4pm PT / 7pm ET, BC Place, Vancouver

[reggietfc]

6 minutes ago, canuckgbp said:

 

a interview with a few canadian players would be nice

[The Beaver 2.0]

One thing's for sure: no nation is going to book friendlies until we get this sorted. No nation worth playing, at least

[The Beaver 2.0]

10 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

I dont have allergies bro... allergies are for pussies 

Well, at least you're consistent, bruh. 😉

Edited June 6, 2022 by The Beaver 2.0

[Ally McCoist]

If the Curaçao game happens I hope people bring posters that scrutinize the CSA.

[Gian-Luca]

@The Beaver 2.0Bontis compared the CSA's offer (which we know is 30%) to that of other WC-bound nations in terms of what they pay.

While he was overly-passionate and everyone here is shitting upon him (and fair enough on the tone front), at the end of the day I understood the CSA's basic position on what he said - we can't afford the players' proposal and our 30% is in line with what the other WC nations provide to their players.

Conversely, can anyone tell me why the players feel that 30% is unacceptable and it has to be 40%? Because I don't understand what the reasoning is based on the players poorly worded "Where is the money?" statement. If they have done their own research and discovered otherwise about what the benchmark is than what the CSA says it is, that would be one thing but I'm assuming they haven't because there is absolutely nothing about that in their statement

It pains me to say all this because it's the players I cheer for, not the association. But I can't let that blind me that I don't know where the insistence on this issue - to the point of screwing over the fans in BC (or whoever else travelled for the game), the thousands of fans who were going to watch online and themselves (denying themselves a prep match) - is coming from.

The WC ticket situation, I am more sympathetic with but it sounded like there would be progress on that, at least.

[The Beaver 2.0]

9 minutes ago, Ally McCoist said:

If the Curaçao game happens I hope people bring posters that scrutinize the CSA.

If the game happens--because a new deal will be in place--then I hope we score a bunch of goals and put this embarrassing fiasco behind us faster than SpursFlu can blame the CBC for low fat organic yoghurt.

Edited June 6, 2022 by The Beaver 2.0

[The Beaver 2.0]

1 minute ago, Gian-Luca said:

@The Beaver 2.0Bontis compared the CSA's offer (which we know is 30%) to that of other WC-bound nations in terms of what they pay.

While he was overly-passionate and everyone here is shitting upon him (and fair enough on the tone front), at the end of the day I understood the CSA's basic position on what he said - we can't afford the players' proposal and our 30% is in line with what the other WC nations provide to their players.

Conversely, can anyone tell me why the players feel that 30% is unacceptable and it has to be 40%? Because I don't understand what the reasoning is based on the players poorly worded "Where is the money?" statement. If they have done their own research and discovered otherwise about what the benchmark is than what the CSA says it is, that would be one thing but I'm assuming they haven't because there is absolutely nothing about that in their statement

It pains me to say all this because it's the players I cheer for, not the association. But I can't let that blind me that I don't know where the insistence on this issue - to the point of screwing over the fans in BC (or whoever else travelled for the game), the thousands of fans who were going to watch online and themselves (denying themselves a prep match) - is coming from.

The WC ticket situation, I am more sympathetic with but it sounded like there would be progress on that, at least.

But do we know that it is 30%? Does the general public? I have not seen anything confirming that percentage. I agree with everything you say here, but without the percentage the media and public are being asked to just take his word for it that what the CSA has offered is in keeping with what other nations pay

[SpursFlu]

I think the local Antifa chapter is gathering on Commercial Drive and prepping up a giant banner for Thursday. Yah stick it to the man!

Johny Johny wake up.. you were having another one of your wet dreams

[Gian-Luca]

4 minutes ago, The Beaver 2.0 said:

But do we know that it is 30%? Does the general public? I have not seen anything confirming that percentage. I agree with everything you say here, but without the percentage the media and public are being asked to just take his word for it that what the CSA has offered is in keeping with what other nations pay

Re: the general public, the 30% was mentioned in various articles such as this one:

https://www.thestar.com/sports/soccer/opinion/2022/06/04/mens-national-team-stays-off-the-field-after-rejecting-canada-soccer-pitch.html

They could be lying about this I suppose and being untruthful about the benchmark comment, but that seems a very silly thing to lie about since the data would be coming from other nations & independently verifiable.

[Kadenge]

So is this why Borjan didn't bother to show up?

[Cheeta]

23 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

I think the local Antifa chapter is gathering on Commercial Drive and prepping up a giant banner for Thursday. Yah stick it to the man!

Johny Johny wake up.. you were having another one of your wet dreams

Soldier on, brother. 

[Bison44]

Has Herdman said anything??  Is this why he was out of town??  UGGHHH, what a fiasco.  

[johnyb]

I've been reading pages of a forum for the last 2 hours instead of watching Soccer and I'm amazed at how many people on here are taking the players side without knowing any of the facts. All we know is the Players decided to not play the game and posted a brief letter as to why. The letter did not state their list of demands and the CSA, in their press conference, stated their offer was fair and was consistent with other federations around the world. The players knew cancelling the game was going to piss off thousands of fans. Bontis' press conference wasn't pretty, but what if he is telling the truth. All I can say is that in all the Pro sports strikes I've seen over the years the owners and players always come out ahead and the only losers are the fans. Nothing that happened today changes my view.

[RS]

9 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Has Herdman said anything??  Is this why he was out of town??  UGGHHH, what a fiasco.  

Herdman’s not going to say anything publicly. 

He’s stuck between his employers and his players. If he takes either side (publicly) it would be a bad look.

[Bison44]

2 minutes ago, RS said:

Herdman’s not going to say anything publicly. 

He’s stuck between his employers and his players. If he takes either side (publicly) it would be a bad look.

He doesnt take a side, hes on canadas side, lets work this out, lets not let this derail the success they have all worked for for years.  Why did the CSA work so hard to get this game if the players were threatening not to play? WHy not take the time to hash this out once the first game was scrubbed?  Now we look like twice the idiots we did before and we are out a second set of apperance fees and prob going to get sued by Panama.  

[RS]

7 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

He doesnt take a side, hes on canadas side, lets work this out, lets not let this derail the success they have all worked for for years.  Why did the CSA work so hard to get this game if the players were threatening not to play? WHy not take the time to hash this out once the first game was scrubbed?  Now we look like twice the idiots we did before and we are out a second set of apperance fees and prob going to get sued by Panama.  

All of what you’re saying is true, but Herdman speaking publicly wouldn’t change any of it.

”Let’s work this out” would just be the kind of meaningless lip service that many here have been accusing him of doing too much of.

[Bison44]

Well who else has any pull with the media, the players and with the CSA??  Who would be in a better spot to try and get them together for the good of soccer in canada???  If this is really something the players have been trying to change for a long time, Herdman will know all about it, and he should know plenty about the money situation with CSA.  

[Shway]

9 minutes ago, RS said:

All of what you’re saying is true, but Herdman speaking publicly wouldn’t change any of it.

”Let’s work this out” would just be the kind of meaningless lip service that many here have been accusing him of doing too much of.

Facts.

As the neutral he is in this situation. I don’t want to hear anything from him. Because if we do, it’ll be wishy washy playing both sides. 

[footballfreak]

If Bontis communicates as opaquely with the players as he does with the media, it’s no wonder they can’t come to an agreement. Does he even breakdown the numbers with them or does he just start shaking and saying untenable over and over?

[RJB]

1 hour ago, Gian-Luca said:

Conversely, can anyone tell me why the players feel that 30% is unacceptable and it has to be 40%? Because I don't understand what the reasoning is based on the players poorly worded "Where is the money?" statement. If they have done their own research and discovered otherwise about what the benchmark is than what the CSA says it is, that would be one thing but I'm assuming they haven't because there is absolutely nothing about that in their statement

This is where we need our intrepid journalists to do their magic.  If it is simply 30% vs 40%, and that 30% is the standard, then something is certainly fishy.  I'm interested to see what comes out in the wash this week.  We can expect to know a lot more before Thursday. 

[RS]

5 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Well who else has any pull with the media, the players and with the CSA??  Who would be in a better spot to try and get them together for the good of soccer in canada???  If this is really something the players have been trying to change for a long time, Herdman will know all about it, and he should know plenty about the money situation with CSA.  

What exactly would you have Herdman say to the media? 

He can’t come out and support the CSA. He does that and instantly loses the locker room. 

If he supports the players, he’d be publicly taking a stand against the people who sign his paycheques.

The only thing he can publicly do is wait it out. Sure, he can go to bat for one side or the other behind closed doors, but there would literally be nothing good that comes out of Herdman addressing this issue with the media.

[JohnnyFranchise]

1 minute ago, footballfreak said:

If Bontis communicates as opaquely with the players as he does with the media, it’s no wonder they can’t come to an agreement. Does he even breakdown the numbers with them or does he just start shaking and saying untenable over and over?

don't forget arbitrarily picking up random papers and waving them around. could've made a drinking game out of that during the presser.

[Watchmen]

33 minutes ago, johnyb said:

All I can say is that in all the Pro sports strikes I've seen over the years the owners and players always come out ahead and the only losers are the fans. 

The NHL players were locked out in 2005, forfeited 25% of their wages, contribute roughly 13% of their annual wages to an escrow account, their top end players are currently paid less than they were in 2004, and wage increases have not kept up with the salary escalations relative to other North American sports.  In 2013, they were locked out again and forfeited an additional amount of revenue to the owners.  They have very much not "come out ahead" in their bargaining sessions with the league.  Meanwhile, the same leadership that beat down the players locked the league in to a 10 year tv contract for a fixed rate just before the the tv value for sports leagues skyrocketed.  That same leadership then blamed the players for them "being unreasonable and unaffordable".  Man, that last part sounds familiar....

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

2 minutes ago, RJB said:

This is where we need our intrepid journalists to do their magic.  If it is simply 30% vs 40%, and that 30% is the standard, then something is certainly fishy.  I'm interested to see what comes out in the wash this week.  We can expect to know a lot more before Thursday. 

Think the CSB angle and by extension the Mediapro deal may be the key but our intrepid journalists don't tend to rock the boat if it jeopardizes future access. 

[Watchmen]

I'm seeing a lot of "but what if Bontis is telling the truth?" in this thread, and I have to wonder what is that the CSA has done over the last few decades that would engender this kind of faith in them.