Luc de Fougerolles

[Bertuzzi44]

6 hours ago, VinceA said:

Random Q but why did it take so long for Edgar to get a senior cap? He wasn't capped until 2011.

We actually had active youth teams then, and iirc especially the U-20s Edgar featured with quite a bit?

[CanadaFan123]

23 minutes ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

We actually had active youth teams then, and iirc especially the U-20s Edgar featured with quite a bit?

Yeah and then Mitchell never called him, or anyone really from that u20 2007 team that fell flat. 
 

Then Hart took over in 2009 and didn’t call him until 2011 (and even then, I think we were missing quite a few guys against Greece which led to his call). 

[jordan]

I’ll try again, probably why he wasn’t played

2007-08 6 games 189 mins 

2008-09 13 games 701 mins

2009-10 17 games 1439 mins

2010-11 8 games 352 mins

[TOcanadafan]

On 11/1/2023 at 8:20 PM, Shway said:

Does anyone think he could genuinely get minutes in the next few windows? 

I'm thinking Kone, but does he have that much potential that he would bypass Vitoria, McGraw, Bombito, Waterman, and Zator in that RCB depth chart?

Would any of our current CB’s make the pitch for a PL club in a cup match and put in a man-of-the-match performance?  He should have started against Japan and should be starting in the November window… enough of the mediocrity.

Edited November 5, 2023 by TOcanadafan

[Vasi]

If this guy is getting competitive minutes for a pl club, in my opinion he should be close to the top of the depth chart.

If he gets PL minutes this season he should be out #1 cb. Don't care how old he is. Ramos was 18 when he secured real's starting cb spot. (Not saying he will be anywhere near his quality).If you can play in the pl you are ready.

Considering how old and flimsily our cb's are, I'd start him now and have him experienced for 26. That is if he wants to play for us. 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Vasi

[narduch]

And for the record he still has not played a single minute in the EPL 

[Borjans Sweatpants]

58 minutes ago, narduch said:

And for the record he still has not played a single minute in the EPL 

No, but he’s played minutes for a Premier League club and been on the bench for EPL games. A good distinction you make, but impressive nonetheless.

[narduch]

10 hours ago, Borjans Sweatpants said:

No, but he’s played minutes for a Premier League club and been on the bench for EPL games. A good distinction you make, but impressive nonetheless.

I remember when Sandro Grande played an Intertoto game for Brescia. He never did end up playing a Serie A game for them however.

And we all know the story of Justin Smith and Nice.

Edited November 6, 2023 by narduch

[Vasi]

7 minutes ago, narduch said:

I remember when Sandro Grande played am Intertoto game for Brescia. He never did end up playing a Serie A game for them however.

And we all know the story of Justin Smith and Nice.

Yes. But forgive me for being positive. 

At some point players do pan out. Not all of our defense prospects will suck ass. 

[Shway]

3 hours ago, TOcanadafan said:

Would any of our current CB’s make the pitch for a PL club in a cup match and put in a man-of-the-match performance?  He should have started against Japan and should be starting in the November window… enough of the mediocrity.

It was simply a question. 
Is two professional matches good enough to trump the other seasoned professionals, who are actually playing albeit at inferior levels?

I'm not sure, is all I'm saying. 

[Kadenge]

10 hours ago, Shway said:

It was simply a question. 
Is two professional matches good enough to trump the other seasoned professionals, who are actually playing albeit at inferior levels?

I'm not sure, is all I'm saying. 

It's a good question and why, if he was willing, Biello should have played him v Japan. If he did and he performed well there would be less uncertainty now. Its difficult to project from 1 game. Manjrekar James had a MOTM performance v Atalanta in Champions League. I don't think any of our current CBs have played CL or other Euro competitions...Vitoria? What I can say is that LDF was very calm & confident in his debut vs a  Championship team that is close to the top in their league. His passing, ability on the ball and positioning were all very good.  2 massive games v Jamaica but depending on the score and how our stating CBs are playing, I could see LDF getting some playing time, just not starting unless he sees mins for Fulham btw now and the break.

[InglewoodJack]

He's not good enough to jump our starters yet, but he's good enough to be given the opportunity. There's countless examples in soccer and just about any sport where a young player gets a shot because the guy ahead of him is injured or simply because he has a lot of potential, he gets minutes, looks great, and never goes back. He's not competing for minutes with Virgil Van Dijk, he's in a position where realistically he can start leaping our starters over the next 12 months, and if not, definitely within the next 2 years. Obviously capping him is the biggest deal, but I still don't think the margin of difference between LDF and any other CB in our pool is wide enough that we can toss away a winnable game because LDF makes a bad mistake. Maybe Jamaica scores because LDF panicked with the ball and lost it close to goal, but if he's not playing, maybe it's Miller making a wreckless pass to a Jamaican winger or maybe it's Vitoria not moving fast enough.

Hell, we not only called up Bombito, but started him, and then also started him out of position just a few months ago. He has more "experience" but I don't believe for one second that NCAA ball and a handful of games with the worst team in MLS is in any shape deserving of a start unless you really think this player has that special something, and if you think he's got that special something, what is there to say about one of the most promising CB prospects in the entire premier league? 

[costarg]

13 hours ago, Vasi said:

Yes. But forgive me for being positive. 

At some point players do pan out. Not all of our defense prospects will suck ass. 

Agreed.  I will add: I hate to sound negative, but I will state the obvious, all our CB's are more than capable of sucking ass in moments and have shown major weaknesses.  So at this point it's about finding who will suck ass less.  Continuing the status quo is just ridiculous, we know our current lineup is not good enough.

[costarg]

1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said:

He's not good enough to jump our starters yet, but he's good enough to be given the opportunity. There's countless examples in soccer and just about any sport where a young player gets a shot because the guy ahead of him is injured or simply because he has a lot of potential, he gets minutes, looks great, and never goes back. He's not competing for minutes with Virgil Van Dijk, he's in a position where realistically he can start leaping our starters over the next 12 months, and if not, definitely within the next 2 years. Obviously capping him is the biggest deal, but I still don't think the margin of difference between LDF and any other CB in our pool is wide enough that we can toss away a winnable game because LDF makes a bad mistake. Maybe Jamaica scores because LDF panicked with the ball and lost it close to goal, but if he's not playing, maybe it's Miller making a wreckless pass to a Jamaican winger or maybe it's Vitoria not moving fast enough.

This is what we're ignoring.  We're acting like dethroning Miller, Vitoria and an out of position Johnston is some big deal.  All three of them have shown major lapses in their games.  On top of that they do not compliment each other in any way.  2 of the 3 are short, 2 of the three are slow, none of them are close to being elite, automatic starters or playing at a very high level.  Neither of the 3 had any chance of being noticed or played by an EPL team at 18.  Looking at it that way, LDF as already accomplished more than all 3 of them.  

[InglewoodJack]

5 minutes ago, costarg said:

This is what we're ignoring.  We're acting like dethroning Miller, Vitoria and an out of position Johnston is some big deal.  All three of them have shown major lapses in their games.  On top of that they do not compliment each other in any way.  2 of the 3 are short, 2 of the three are slow, none of them are close to being elite, automatic starters or playing at a very high level.  Neither of the 3 had any chance of being noticed or played by an EPL team at 18.  Looking at it that way, LDF as already accomplished more than all 3 of them.  

Exactly this. With Koleosho last year, he'd have taken minutes away from guys a lot better than him, especially at the world cup where it doesn't matter how good the player is, you don't do a cynical cap tie during your most important games ever. Even with Mitrovic before him or to some extent Tom McGill over this past year, there's a much wider gap between their current form and the guys we want to sub them in for. I just don't see that gap in talent and form between LDF and our guys. Sure, I think our starters are better, and if this was a championship game against the US or Mexico, I'm going with our regulars, but I don't think the margin between us winning and losing against Jamaica is the difference between LDF and Steven Vitoria or Kamal Miller.

Our CB crop is as the kids say, "a 6 pack of mid". If LDF can get MOTM against Ipswitch, surely he can handle Jamaica?

[Bigandy]

14 hours ago, narduch said:

I remember when Sandro Grande played an Intertoto game for Brescia. He never did end up playing a Serie A game for them however.

And we all know the story of Justin Smith and Nice.

Justin smith is 20 years old. Its not much different than corbeanu or even jebbison. Both made the bench alot as a youngster for their div 1 teams. They subsequently got loan moves where you can argue both had failures. Somehow everyone thinks corbeanu is one of our best prospects and smith is an example of failure. 
corbeanu went to div 3 when he was 19 and did okish by scoring 3 goals and getting mintutes. Smith went to div 2 at 19 and had a horrible loan spell. However a year later and smith is getting 90s in div 3. That is not crazy different from corbeanu. 

We can squabble about the level of ligue 3 vs league 1 but the point is that smith at 20 years old as a centerback/CDM (which usually develops later) still has sooooo much time to prove himself and is currently on a normal trajectory and not a failed one. 

[dyslexic nam]

55 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

Justin smith is 20 years old. Its not much different than corbeanu or even jebbison. Both made the bench alot as a youngster for their div 1 teams. They subsequently got loan moves where you can argue both had failures. Somehow everyone thinks corbeanu is one of our best prospects and smith is an example of failure. 
corbeanu went to div 3 when he was 19 and did okish by scoring 3 goals and getting mintutes. Smith went to div 2 at 19 and had a horrible loan spell. However a year later and smith is getting 90s in div 3. That is not crazy different from corbeanu. 

We can squabble about the level of ligue 3 vs league 1 but the point is that smith at 20 years old as a centerback/CDM (which usually develops later) still has sooooo much time to prove himself and is currently on a normal trajectory and not a failed one. 

Yeah, I have definitely not given up on the idea that Smith can be a major player for us in the future.  What I saw at the U20s was that he was playing at a level well above most of his Canadian peers.  Obviously that hasn’t translated into any sort of meteoric club rise, but I still have faith that he is ultimately a very skilled player who can work his way up to a solid playing level and contribute to the CMNT.  

[toontownman]

Surely he gets a cynical cap tie over these next two games. Fantastic to see he is on board again either way. 

[Kadenge]

Just now, toontownman said:

Surely he gets a cynical cap tie over these next two games. Fantastic to see he is on board again either way. 

If he does play, I'm not sure it would be a cynical cap. Early days but  he has has looked good for Fulham in his few appearances. He clearly has the ability. It's just experience he's lacking at this point.

[dyslexic nam]

I don't see it as cynical in terms of us just locking him down and then casting him aside.  I could, however, see a later sub appearance as a likely way he gets on the field.  Just not sure Biello has it in him to start him.  

[EJsens1]

6 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

I don't see it as cynical in terms of us just locking him down and then casting him aside.  I could, however, see a later sub appearance as a likely way he gets on the field.  Just not sure Biello has it in him to start him.  

Other countries ‘cynically’ cap players all the time knowing they likely aren’t in their long term plans. Do what’s best for your country. The goal is to beat other countries when you play them, so look for every edge 

Edited November 8, 2023 by EJsens1

[Obinna]

I think LDF is here on merit. Played for Fulham in a Cup match. Made the bench against United. I don't think we leave out players like Bombito and Brym (CSA golden boys) so that LDF can continue his window shopping.

If things go well in the first leg I think we see him for the second leg, probably as a substitute. 

[Bigandy]

14 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I think LDF is here on merit. Played for Fulham in a Cup match. Made the bench against United. I don't think we leave out players like Bombito and Brym (CSA golden boys) so that LDF can continue his window shopping.

If things go well in the first leg I think we see him for the second leg, probably as a substitute. 

LDF is our best CB. Would he play the best given hes never expereinced concacaf? Probably not. But on pure ability, no other CB could compete at the level he can currently. 

[Shway]

4 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

LDF is our best CB. Would he play the best given hes never expereinced concacaf? Probably not. But on pure ability, no other CB could compete at the level he can currently. 

Man these takes are just outright disrespectful lol. 
I get there's hype, but he hasn't played much. 1 cup match and he's the best in our pool. 

If he wasn't English would he be in the same position? Probably not.

Call me crazy, but I don't think I could say THAT confidently. 

[dyslexic nam]

3 minutes ago, Shway said:

Man these takes are just outright disrespectful lol. 
I get there's hype, but he hasn't played much. 1 cup match and he's the best in our pool. 

If he wasn't English would he be in the same position? Probably not.

Call me crazy, but I don't think I could say THAT confidently. 

For me it isn't about being English - it is about being deemed capable enough to potentially be called upon in arguably the best league in the world (or at least top 2).  Would a team like Fulham be comfortable letting any other CB in our pool sit on their bench or play in cup games?  I just don't see it.