I think the Canadian National Team's success is tied to the US National team success. Do you also cheer for the US National Team to do well?

[trueviking]

And as for supporting the region, I can’t imagine cheering for any CONCACAF team. I hate them all with a passion. Cheating divers. I despise every single one of them. 

[gigi riva]

The MLS has been a big help to Canadian Soccer, and if it wasnt for MLS and maybe  the success of TFC  we would not see CPL(Maybe thats a bit of a stretch). MLS is a decent league not the greatest  and it has given the likes of OSO, Larin , buchanan, etc a place to play 

[football_world]

8 hours ago, Ansem said:

Montagliani had the ambition of hosting a World Cup in 2026 - a national league was a key condition and motivator. Blatter said 3 clubs in MLS wouldn't cut it. Like Gator previously said, where would MLS be without TFC joining in 2007?

So you are saying Blatter demanded the creation of the CPL for Canada to co-host the World Cup with the US and Mexico? If Blatter demanded the creation of the CPL for Canada to co-host the WC, you can also thank the MLS.

Like I said before, interest in forming the CPL from the Canadian owners was from the resurgence of soccer in Canada/US. The resurgence of soccer in Canada is owed to the resurgence of soccer in the US, primarily through the MLS and the performance of the US national team at the World Cup.  Without the MLS, you don't have a resurgence in soccer in Canada/US.  Then you don't have the CPL. 

I can't imagine any scenario where the CPL is started without the Canadian owners of the CPL seeing the success of the MLS first.  Just go back to the period between the fall of the NASL and the first introduction of Canadian MLS teams. There was no interest from business owners in forming a league like the CPL between the fall of the NASL up to the introduction of the Canadian MLS teams.

[Ansem]

6 hours ago, football_world said:

So you are saying Blatter demanded the creation of the CPL for Canada to co-host the World Cup with the US and Mexico? If Blatter demanded the creation of the CPL for Canada to co-host the WC, you can also thank the MLS.

At the time, Canada was going solo for 2026 before Infantino expanded the World Cup to 48 teams. Hosting 2026 (Solo) was conditional to the CSA having a true domestic league
 

6 hours ago, football_world said:

Like I said before, interest in forming the CPL from the Canadian owners was from the resurgence of soccer in Canada/US.

2026 was a main driver, also - Bob Young opting for a Canadian league instead of launching a club in a USSF league was also a big catalyst.  The 3 clubs in Canada were definitely a big influence but without Montagliani wanting a solo bid and Bob Young opting for MLS / USL instead - there's most likely no CPL.

 

6 hours ago, football_world said:

The resurgence of soccer in Canada is owed to the resurgence of soccer in the US, primarily through the MLS and the performance of the US national team at the World Cup. 

Important to point out the 2007 U20 World Cup in Canada, without it - there's possibly no BMO field and TFC isn't the same club that it is today.  I mean, it's not like an average attendance of 22k for a U20 World Cup had anything to do with a push to make soccer work here... with games and solid attendance coast to coast

Most would agree it was the Montreal and TFC playoffs that really gave MLS attention in Canada - it took 2 Canadians clubs facing each other after 9 years of irrelevancy.*

*TV ratings certainly supports that

USMNT performances being a factor... I just don't see it, people care a TONS more about England, Brazil, France and Italy than they ever did the USMNT

 

7 hours ago, football_world said:

I can't imagine any scenario where the CPL is started without the Canadian owners of the CPL seeing the success of the MLS first.  Just go back to the period between the fall of the NASL and the first introduction of Canadian MLS teams. There was no interest from business owners in forming a league like the CPL between the fall of the NASL up to the introduction of the Canadian MLS teams.

What are you trying to do?

We all acknowledge the 3 Canadian clubs in MLS contribution but to come here and "demand" that we ACKNOWLEDGE MLS as the main reason for CPL is bizarre.

It's like my first serious girlfriend asking me 2 decades later to acknowledge that I'm no longer a virgin. I mean, ok - sure but I was able to get laid just fine without her ever since...🙄

[football_world]

28 minutes ago, Ansem said:

At the time, Canada was going solo for 2026 before Infantino expanded the World Cup to 48 teams. Hosting 2026 (Solo) was conditional to the CSA having a true domestic league
 

2026 was a main driver, also - Bob Young opting for a Canadian league instead of launching a club in a USSF league was also a big catalyst.  The 3 clubs in Canada were definitely a big influence but without Montagliani wanting a solo bid and Bob Young opting for MLS / USL instead - there's most likely no CPL.

 

Important to point out the 2007 U20 World Cup in Canada, without it - there's possibly no BMO field and TFC isn't the same club that it is today.  I mean, it's not like an average attendance of 22k for a U20 World Cup had anything to do with a push to make soccer work here... with games and solid attendance coast to coast

Most would agree it was the Montreal and TFC playoffs that really gave MLS attention in Canada - it took 2 Canadians clubs facing each other after 9 years of irrelevancy.*

*TV ratings certainly supports that

USMNT performances being a factor... I just don't see it, people care a TONS more about England, Brazil, France and Italy than they ever did the USMNT

 

What are you trying to do?

We all acknowledge the 3 Canadian clubs in MLS contribution but to come here and "demand" that we ACKNOWLEDGE MLS as the main reason for CPL is bizarre.

It's like my first serious girlfriend asking me 2 decades later to acknowledge that I'm no longer a virgin. I mean, ok - sure but I was able to get laid just fine without her ever since...🙄

You bring up a lot of points. But it's a chain reaction that led to the formation of the CPL, starting with the success of the MLS.

Of course the success of TFC helped MLS succeed.  But your exact quote was, "'I'd like to give way more credit to the 3 Canadian clubs than the league."  I don't even understand the logic of such a quote.

The credit for the formation of the CPL was due to a lot of factors, including MLS and the resurgence of soccer in Canada/US being one of the factors.  Why would you give more credit to the 3 Canadian clubs?  The 3 Canadian clubs wouldn't exist without the MLS in the first place.  And the MLS may not exist and could have gone bankrupt, if the US hadn't made that run to the quarterfinals in the 2002 World Cup (read this article on how the US run in the 2002 World Cup was a factor that helped the MLS survive - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2016/04/12/mls-folded-for-a-few-days-in-2001-and-somehow-kept-it-a-secret-until-now/ - albeit, there were other factors that helped the MLS survive as well).

So a lot of factors contributed to the formation of the CPL.  Saying something like, "'I'd like to give way more credit to the 3 Canadian clubs than the league," makes no sense and is kind of looking at a very warped lens of history.

Edited April 5, 2022 by football_world

[narduch]

The funny thing is had the 3 MLS clubs done a better job at developing Canadian talent there probably would have been way less impetus to start the CPL.

People want to give MLS credit for our recent success but it basically took 15 years of MLS being in Canada before we finally qualified for a World Cup. This shouldn't be a brag. That's actually quite sad.

One thing that I do find ironic is that it wasn't until the CPL started that the 3 Canadian MLS clubs started taking playing Canadians more seriously. They needed a kick in the ass from an upstart league basically. 

 

 

Edited April 5, 2022 by narduch

[football_world]

38 minutes ago, narduch said:

People want to give MLS credit for our recent success but it basically took 15 years of MLS being in Canada before we finally qualified for a World Cup. This shouldn't be a brag. That's actually quite sad.

The Montreal Olympique and the Toronto Metros joined the NASL in 1971: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Soccer_League_(1968–1984). 15 years later in 1986, Canada qualified for the World Cup.  It just takes time to develop players.

Having said that, MLS gets credit, CPL gets credit, and other foreign teams outside Canada (ie. European teams) that developed our players get credit for this World Cup qualification. 

Edited April 5, 2022 by football_world

[Bison44]

3 minutes ago, football_world said:

The Montreal Olympique and the Toronto Metros joined the NASL in 1971: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Soccer_League_(1968–1984). 15 years later in 1986, Canada qualified for the World Cup.  It just takes time to develop players.

Having said that, MLS gets credit, CPL gets credit, and other foreign teams outside Canada (ie. European teams) that developed our players get credit for this World Cup qualification. 

For someone who seems informed you are missing a huge piece to the puzzle.  NCAA/college programs.  I think we have more guys who were out of the NCAA than strictly from MLS academies on the CMNT now.  Larin, Buchanon, lareya, Miller, Johnston all big pieces of the puzzle that came from that talent stream.  

[Califax]

3 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

For someone who seems informed you are missing a huge piece to the puzzle.  NCAA/college programs.  I think we have more guys who were out of the NCAA than strictly from MLS academies on the CMNT now.  Larin, Buchanon, lareya, Miller, Johnston all big pieces of the puzzle that came from that talent stream.  

Excellent point. The "USA sucks" crowd should have fun with it. 

[football_world]

4 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

For someone who seems informed you are missing a huge piece to the puzzle.  NCAA/college programs.  I think we have more guys who were out of the NCAA than strictly from MLS academies on the CMNT now.  Larin, Buchanon, lareya, Miller, Johnston all big pieces of the puzzle that came from that talent stream.  

Sure, the NCAA also played a role.  I mean, this would just give more evidence that Canada is benefitting from the rising tide of American soccer.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

1 hour ago, narduch said:

...One thing that I do find ironic is that it wasn't until the CPL started that the 3 Canadian MLS clubs started taking playing Canadians more seriously...

Fact check: TFC started investing heavily in their academy program long before CanPL was even in the planning stage.

https://www.torontofc.ca/news/downsview-become-academy-home 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[Ansem]

14 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

For someone who seems informed you are missing a huge piece to the puzzle.  NCAA/college programs.  I think we have more guys who were out of the NCAA than strictly from MLS academies on the CMNT now.  Larin, Buchanon, lareya, Miller, Johnston all big pieces of the puzzle that came from that talent stream.  

Re Larin : So he became "magically" good once he got into a US college?

I always wonder why at the time TFC were barely interested at what was going on in their backyard - if they did, all those guys would be wearing TFC jerseys. The fact that they some had to go to US colleges for a shot at turning pro since USports didn't exist for MLS is a problem for me and nothing to brag about.

[narduch]

13 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Fact check: TFC started investing heavily in their academy program long before CanPL was even in the planning stage.

https://www.torontofc.ca/news/downsview-become-academy-home 

Its one thing to invest in an academy and player development and another to get value out of it.

We are all aware of the prospect churn that TFC went through until recently. 

 

[Ansem]

2 hours ago, football_world said:

The 3 Canadian clubs wouldn't exist without the MLS in the first place.

I don't know about TFC but Montreal and Vancouver predates MLS so.....

Why are you fishing for acknowledgement? We all agree that MLS helps, we don't have to agree/nitpick on proportions...

Gee, some aren't liking they didn't finish 1st in the ocho

[GasPed]

17 minutes ago, football_world said:

Sure, the NCAA also played a role.  I mean, this would just give more evidence that Canada is benefitting from the rising tide of American soccer.

I understand that Canada benefits hugely from being neighbours with the US - it's not just soccer, it's international trade, military defense, financial markets, tourism, etc.  And certainly, in general, whatever benefits the US will usually benefit us as well.

I also happen to really enjoy many aspects of US culture, history and sights when I visit the country.

But there's no freaking way as long as I live that I will cheer for a US National team in any sport at any event, period.   No freaking way.  Sorry.

[Kent]

11 hours ago, football_world said:

I can't imagine any scenario where the CPL is started without the Canadian owners of the CPL seeing the success of the MLS first.  Just go back to the period between the fall of the NASL and the first introduction of Canadian MLS teams. There was no interest from business owners in forming a league like the CPL between the fall of the NASL up to the introduction of the Canadian MLS teams.

Canada literally started it's own league in that timeframe. It may have happened again without MLS, it may not have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Soccer_League_(1987–1992)

[narduch]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

I don't know about TFC but Montreal and Vancouver predates MLS so.....

Why are you fishing for acknowledgement? We all agree that MLS helps, we don't have to agree/nitpick on proportions...

Gee, some aren't liking they didn't finish 1st in the ocho

In my opinion we are being trolled here and a lot of us have taken the bait.

Edited April 5, 2022 by narduch

[Califax]

2 minutes ago, narduch said:

In my opinion we are being trolled here and a lot of us having taken the bait.

Americans could join hands along the border from Seattle to Bangor and shit quarters for 40 days and 40 nights, and some ideologically entrenched posters on here would be mad at them for littering. 
 

[Metro]

1 hour ago, Califax said:

Americans could join hands along the border from Seattle to Bangor and shit quarters for 40 days and 40 nights, and some ideologically entrenched posters on here would be mad at them for littering. 
 

Effin' jaggoff Americans, are quarters all we good for?

[The Beaver 2.0]

19 hours ago, TOcanadafan said:

I would really like to bond with the US in despising Mexico and the other Latin Concacaf nations for all the ways they make the beautiful game ugly… but then snots like Brendan Aaronson (who’s game I actually like) show their sucky ‘personality’ in interviews after being frustrated by us.  Or ‘Captain America’ pouty Pulisic flopping around the pitch when the going gets tough.  Or McKennie’s endless selfish acts.  Tyler Adams seems kinda cool though.

Yeah, I agree. I WANT to like them, but why are so many of them so bloody douche-y?  Zimmerman seems fine. And Adams. And Bradley, back when he played.  And there are others, I'm sure.  There's something kind of entitled and bratty in their general attitude, and I don't get it.  

I like how our lads carry themselves: Audacity paired with humility. Powerful combination.

[ted]

18 hours ago, gigi riva said:

The MLS has been a big help to Canadian Soccer, and if it wasnt for MLS and maybe  the success of TFC  we would not see CPL(Maybe thats a bit of a stretch). MLS is a decent league not the greatest  and it has given the likes of OSO, Larin , buchanan, etc a place to play 

All of that is true and has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand: which is cheering for the US National Team. Canadians taking advantage of their league is no reason to cheer for the enemy.

[Bison44]

^^^ Exactly....r u fer us, or agin us??  

 

[kacbru]

1 minute ago, Bison44 said:

^^^ Exactly....r u fer us, or agin us??  

 

Do you mean us or U.S.?😀

[Macksam]

I think the success of the US national team is good for the region, which ultimately is good for us in a all tides rising sort of way, not sure that's the proper way to word that analogy. However, I think our success, and the USMNT's success is more tied to the increase in MLS' popularity. I am not saying we won't improve if MLS stagnates but our NT will improve a lot quicker if the popularity of the league continues to increase. A strong MLS will encourage more kids to stick with the sport and they will strive to reach the top not unlike what the Raps and the NBA did for Canadian basketball talent.   

[A_Gagne]

Late to this thread, but got to say I agree @football_world's premise that there is a positive feedback loop between the success of the USMNT and success and level of play in MLS, and that a better MLS is good for Canadian footie.

I would acknowledge MLS is an America first league, and the Canadian teams and players are often second class citizens but the above remains true, and I don't think being a partisan CMNT fan is mutually exclusive with recognizing that we don't exist on an island and sometimes what's good for other teams can be good for us as well.

By the same token I am a fan of improvement of the level of other CONCACAF  national teams and the CONCACAF Champions league. Again I feel like these are tides that raise all boats, including and most importantly our own.

I also generally cheer for (most) CONCACAF teams to do well against national teams from other confederations because I think it enhances the reputation of CONCACAF generally, which ultimately is good for Canadian footie, and provides more opportunities for Canadian players abroad. Except Honduras... F@#% Honduras!