The Importance of Alphonso Davies

[sebdeserio]

From what I've heard Davies was better at the same age but this guy has a higher ceiling. In any case don't think Davies'll get anywhere close to playing as a winger at Madrid either.

[Bigandy]

2 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

As a player, sure, but was he scoring bangers like that? Don’t think we can make any inferences about him being better than Davies in any way, but that’s not a kid you bring in to mould into an LB. 

A free kick says nothing about the kids ability to play - especially as a winger, or that hes not someone you mould into a lb. davies goal against DC was filthy good as was both his goals against Minnesota. 

however, watching some other highlights, it seems that nestory likes to push the ball past the fullback on the outside and smash the ball in from a tight angle. Some fantastic goals but thats much more one dimensional than phonzies highlights and against weaker opposition. I would imagine a better fullback would be able to handle a simple, knock the ball 5 feet and then hit it hard. 

Im sure hes a talent but not enough for us to say he would keep davies from being a winger. Theres other reasons for that. 

[InglewoodJack]

27 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

A free kick says nothing about the kids ability to play - especially as a winger, or that hes not someone you mould into a lb. davies goal against DC was filthy good as was both his goals against Minnesota. 

however, watching some other highlights, it seems that nestory likes to push the ball past the fullback on the outside and smash the ball in from a tight angle. Some fantastic goals but thats much more one dimensional than phonzies highlights and against weaker opposition. I would imagine a better fullback would be able to handle a simple, knock the ball 5 feet and then hit it hard. 

Im sure hes a talent but not enough for us to say he would keep davies from being a winger. Theres other reasons for that. 

My bad, this is the clip I meant to share, not just the free kick:

https://x.com/eurofootcom/status/1722894353339707777?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q
 

Says nothing about Davies ability, but I think if you’re going after one of the most hyped youngsters on the planet who plays as a winger, it’s not because you think your LB can become that winger for you. I don’t think I’ve seen Davies fire rockets like that; his MLS goals especially the ones you mention came more from creative dribbling and a shot in traffic, but this kid is firing rockets that are damn near tearing a whole through the net. 
 

Anyways, MLS is a better league than the A League, and this kid has a very long journey to reach Davies level obviously- just thinks he looks incredible. I think Bayern want to send him to the reserve team first, so depending on what AD does with the contract situation, they may not even play on the same team as each other. Think this kid is planning on coming over in June ‘24 in any case. 

[Bigandy]

2 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

My bad, this is the clip I meant to share, not just the free kick:

https://x.com/eurofootcom/status/1722894353339707777?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q
 

Says nothing about Davies ability, but I think if you’re going after one of the most hyped youngsters on the planet who plays as a winger, it’s not because you think your LB can become that winger for you. I don’t think I’ve seen Davies fire rockets like that; his MLS goals especially the ones you mention came more from creative dribbling and a shot in traffic, but this kid is firing rockets that are damn near tearing a whole through the net. 
 

Anyways, MLS is a better league than the A League, and this kid has a very long journey to reach Davies level obviously- just thinks he looks incredible. I think Bayern want to send him to the reserve team first, so depending on what AD does with the contract situation, they may not even play on the same team as each other. Think this kid is planning on coming over in June ‘24 in any case. 

For sure! And why would bayern want davies as a winger. His attacking output probably wouldnt change all that much tbh and now you lose out on a creative attacker and have to find a new lb. Based on bayerns fullback purchases recently, its much harder to find FB than wingers. 

 Absolute rockets!!! 

[InglewoodJack]

1 minute ago, Bigandy said:

For sure! And why would bayern want davies as a winger. His attacking output probably wouldnt change all that much tbh and now you lose out on a creative attacker and have to find a new lb. Based on bayerns fullback purchases recently, its much harder to find FB than wingers. 

 Absolute rockets!!! 

I think the Davies as a winger for a top club boat has more or less sailed; I think he'll be an LB until he eventually goes back to MLS (hopefully in a bit over a decade of course, before retiring as a player/owner of Edmonton's new CPL club), so a part of me sharing that is just wanting to talk about how insane that kid looks. But to your point, it doesn't make sense. That said, Bayern has Guerrero as the Davies back up, and IIRC, Guerrero was one of the best LBs in the Bundesliga after Davies, so they have a very good option if they need to move Davies around or if they lose him, but I doubt that he's going to change positions for a number of reasons outside of this kid. Though he looks awesome. If he can hit bangers like that for Bayern, it's going to get really scary really soon.

[kacbru]

One thing is certain, he has a much better back-flip goal celebration.

[InglewoodJack]

52 minutes ago, kacbru said:

One thing is certain, he has a much better back-flip goal celebration.

You figure that there’s a contract provision in his deal that bans him from doing that- the manager is damn near gonna have a heart attack waiting for him to land wrong and take his own ankle out, lol

[frmr]

Pretty good discussion on the potential move to RM. I agree with most of it. Would be an extremely exciting move if it comes to fruition.

[Shway]

Would be unreal to see him at Real. I hope it happens.
They are creating a team that could dominate longer than their last dynasty team, once all the puzzles are in place.

[frmr]

23 minutes ago, Shway said:

Would be unreal to see him at Real. I hope it happens.
They are creating a team that could dominate longer than their last dynasty team, once all the puzzles are in place.

Yeah this is the real exciting part. Him joining based on the club's stature is one thing, but they have some of the very best and most exciting young players in the world right now and Davies would fit right in with that group. There's talks of them triggering Haaland's release clause as well which is I think 200MM currently. Not sure how realistic that is, but regardless, they certainly seem to be trying to build the next Galacticos team, and having a Canadian Galactico would have been far beyond our wildest dreams in the past.

[Unnamed Trialist]

This Real Madrid rumour is caked with naivety, it's incredible how simplistic the One Soccer pundits are about it. Pretty well in line with Davies's agent as well, with these grade-school ways of pressuring. And very disrespectful to Bayern: why ruin this great relationship, the chance at being a legendary loyal BM player, by treating them this way, not being up front and applying amateur pressure tactics? If I were Davies I'd want to leave Bayern able to say thank you and with the fans honouring you, not out the back door to the sound of jeers.

Anyways, they can't talk yet, there can only be a transfer offer. RM and no other club is just going to throw 70 million on the table in January when he has a year and a half left and could sign basically on a free in Jan 2025. 

Then, no club will ever say they only want such and such a player, and only that player, as it just raises a transfer price. This is why, not surprisingly, today in the Spanish press articles on Real Madrid looking at Grimaldo the Leverkusen fullback have come out. They are making sure---this is leaked by RM of course--that everyone knows they have other options. Some watching Germany closely this year say Grimaldo is one of the best fullbacks in the league this year, apart from the fact that he scores and assists--he is far more efficient in attack than Davies, and probably not worse in defense. And then his transfer price would be about half, or even less.

I am sure other names will appear to calm the Davies rumours, or at least to temper the money being expected for him (I think if Davies can be bought for 60 and under this year that is a good deal, in a year from now it'd be below that).

The other reason Grimaldo is out there as an option is because he's ex Masia, so it'd be a coup to have an ex Barça at RM being successful. Have to say this as folks repeat how Davies destroyed Barça in that Covid quarter final in Portugal and that is a reason why RM might like him. As if the mentality were so reductionist and rudimentary. Yes, teams like Barça and RM play these little mind games, and try to bid for similar players, often symbolically, to force up prices the rival really does want. 

My personal view is that Davies and his agent should shut up a bit, respect their club, ensure his legacy is solid there no matter what, and negotiate in absolute good faith all the way through. Davies at Bayern is also part of Canadian soccer legacy, it'd be a shame for him to leave with bad blood after what they've done for each other.

[Aird25]

2 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

This Real Madrid rumour is caked with naivety, it's incredible how simplistic the One Soccer pundits are about it. Pretty well in line with Davies's agent as well, with these grade-school ways of pressuring. And very disrespectful to Bayern: why ruin this great relationship, the chance at being a legendary loyal BM player, by treating them this way, not being up front and applying amateur pressure tactics? If I were Davies I'd want to leave Bayern able to say thank you and with the fans honouring you, not out the back door to the sound of jeers.

Anyways, they can't talk yet, there can only be a transfer offer. RM and no other club is just going to throw 70 million on the table in January when he has a year and a half left and could sign basically on a free in Jan 2025. 

Then, no club will ever say they only want such and such a player, and only that player, as it just raises a transfer price. This is why, not surprisingly, today in the Spanish press articles on Real Madrid looking at Grimaldo the Leverkusen fullback have come out. They are making sure---this is leaked by RM of course--that everyone knows they have other options. Some watching Germany closely this year say Grimaldo is one of the best fullbacks in the league this year, apart from the fact that he scores and assists--he is far more efficient in attack than Davies, and probably not worse in defense. And then his transfer price would be about half, or even less.

I am sure other names will appear to calm the Davies rumours, or at least to temper the money being expected for him (I think if Davies can be bought for 60 and under this year that is a good deal, in a year from now it'd be below that).

The other reason Grimaldo is out there as an option is because he's ex Masia, so it'd be a coup to have an ex Barça at RM being successful. Have to say this as folks repeat how Davies destroyed Barça in that Covid quarter final in Portugal and that is a reason why RM might like him. As if the mentality were so reductionist and rudimentary. Yes, teams like Barça and RM play these little mind games, and try to bid for similar players, often symbolically, to force up prices the rival really does want. 

My personal view is that Davies and his agent should shut up a bit, respect their club, ensure his legacy is solid there no matter what, and negotiate in absolute good faith all the way through. Davies at Bayern is also part of Canadian soccer legacy, it'd be a shame for him to leave with bad blood after what they've done for each other.

I rarely follow transfer sagas and I haven't watched the video yet. What have Davies, his agent, and OneSoccer done that's so offensive to Bayern?

[Unnamed Trialist]

15 minutes ago, Aird25 said:

I rarely follow transfer sagas and I haven't watched the video yet. What have Davies, his agent, and OneSoccer done that's so offensive to Bayern?

His FIFA agent is a clown. There are right ways and wrong ways to pressure a club, there are right and wrong ways to negotiate a contract. Bayern especially expect some loyalty and that is not just a Bayern thing but a German thing, however much they also have their moments of hyocrisy. Simply put: you don't bite the only hand that has ever fed you, the club that bet on you, the club that has enabled you to get to that transfer value and that level of prestige. 

Why would Davies want to sneak away  from Bayern through the back door when he could walk triumphantly and thankfully out the front? His agent slagging them and treating them like hawkers at a flea market does not help.

The entire first contract was done wrong, by the way, because Phonzie entrusted everything to that former coach of his in Edmonton who had zero experience, and then they had to find the Fifa agent to broker it. Not worth going into details now, but it was a hack job, Bayern even came out saying they were stunned both the Caps, and Robinson (who apparently too a %), were able to get away with certain things --there is a transfer bonus they chose to go cheap on and Bayern ending up paying, and other things-- and disrespected standard procedure.

The agent simply does not understand how to negotiate in good faith, and that is not going to help Alphonso. Then the One Soccer guys gushing over the idea, as if it were a done deal, shows they are really clueless.

[Obinna]

12 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

His FIFA agent is a clown. There are right ways and wrong ways to pressure a club, there are right and wrong ways to negotiate a contract. Bayern especially expect some loyalty and that is not just a Bayern thing but a German thing, however much they also have their moments of hyocrisy. Simply put: you don't bite the only hand that has ever fed you, the club that bet on you, the club that has enabled you to get to that transfer value and that level of prestige. 

Why would Davies want to sneak away  from Bayern through the back door when he could walk triumphantly and thankfully out the front? His agent slagging them and treating them like hawkers at a flea market does not help.

The entire first contract was done wrong, by the way, because Phonzie entrusted everything to that former coach of his in Edmonton who had zero experience, and then they had to find the Fifa agent to broker it. Not worth going into details now, but it was a hack job, Bayern even came out saying they were stunned both the Caps, and Robinson (who apparently too a %), were able to get away with certain things --there is a transfer bonus they chose to go cheap on and Bayern ending up paying, and other things-- and disrespected standard procedure.

The agent simply does not understand how to negotiate in good faith, and that is not going to help Alphonso. Then the One Soccer guys gushing over the idea, as if it were a done deal, shows they are really clueless.

Okay I agree with your point but you don't need to exaggerate and go overboard. At no time did his agent "Slag" Bayern (unless I am misinformed). 

[InglewoodJack]

43 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

His FIFA agent is a clown. There are right ways and wrong ways to pressure a club, there are right and wrong ways to negotiate a contract. Bayern especially expect some loyalty and that is not just a Bayern thing but a German thing, however much they also have their moments of hyocrisy. Simply put: you don't bite the only hand that has ever fed you, the club that bet on you, the club that has enabled you to get to that transfer value and that level of prestige.

I don't think this sentimentality is fair to expect from Davies. Sure they bet on Davies, but Davies has held up his end of the bargain (more than expected) and became the best LB in the world. Bayern is I believe the richest club in the world. This next deal that Davies signs will likely be his biggest deal ever unless he signs in the middle east at 30. Bayern publicly says that Davies is one of the faces of their next generation, and yet, behind the scenes, it doesn't seem like they are giving him that level of prioritization.

Davies knows he could go and play on that waterlogged pitch in Jamaica, break his leg and not see the pitch again until he's close to 25. He knows he can get covid again and have it fuck with his heart and affect his level of play. He needs that security to know that his wages and job security are going to be locked in. Bayern is, can, and will use every public trick in the book; calling on Davies' loyalty, hoping that the supporters side with the club over the player, as they usually do, and hope that he stays quiet and plays nice before it affects his marketing value. It's only fair for Davies to use his leverage which is effectively just the fact that he's the best LB in the world and other clubs would love to have him. He may not have that leverage when it's time to sign his next deal, so if it means he has to get dirty with the largest football club on earth to get what's his, so be it. He has one sole responsibility, and that's maximizing what he's getting out of his career before it's too late.

There's also the fact that Davies is a superstar. He does this, Mbappe does this, every intra-premier league transfer target does this, it's what you do when you're this big. We're not talking about Ali Johnston trying to mess with Celtic or Kamal Miller holding out for more money from the only European club that is interested in him. You want the best LB on earth to be in your squad, you give him what he wants. That's it.

[frmr]

49 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

His FIFA agent is a clown. There are right ways and wrong ways to pressure a club, there are right and wrong ways to negotiate a contract. Bayern especially expect some loyalty and that is not just a Bayern thing but a German thing, however much they also have their moments of hyocrisy. Simply put: you don't bite the only hand that has ever fed you, the club that bet on you, the club that has enabled you to get to that transfer value and that level of prestige. 

Why would Davies want to sneak away  from Bayern through the back door when he could walk triumphantly and thankfully out the front? His agent slagging them and treating them like hawkers at a flea market does not help.

The entire first contract was done wrong, by the way, because Phonzie entrusted everything to that former coach of his in Edmonton who had zero experience, and then they had to find the Fifa agent to broker it. Not worth going into details now, but it was a hack job, Bayern even came out saying they were stunned both the Caps, and Robinson (who apparently too a %), were able to get away with certain things --there is a transfer bonus they chose to go cheap on and Bayern ending up paying, and other things-- and disrespected standard procedure.

The agent simply does not understand how to negotiate in good faith, and that is not going to help Alphonso. Then the One Soccer guys gushing over the idea, as if it were a done deal, shows they are really clueless.

I think we need some examples of where Davies or the agent have acted in bad faith. The only things I've seen is that the agent has said that many clubs would be interested in the player (true statement) and that negotiations stalled after the reshuffle of Bayern's top brass. I haven't read anything about the agent or player saying anything bad about Bayern, that they want out, etc. Recently Fabrizio posted a quote from the agent saying any rumours of Davies wanting to head to RM are false and that his focus is on Bayern. Players choose not to resign contracts all the time, nothing in bad faith there. If Davies truly wants to join Real Madrid then he needs to just choose not to resign and move on at the right time, while being respectful to Bayern in the process. I'm not sure I've seen anything contrary to that. Also, you say there are "right" and "wrong" ways to conduct business, I would disagree with that. I think there are effective and ineffective ways, and possibly ways that are admirable or not, but there are many ways to skin a cat, so to speak, and just because you personally disagree with certain tactics—which I agree are being overblown—doesn't make them wrong (objectively speaking).

[InglewoodJack]

Maybe it’s because I follow the NBA too, but I dunno- you have James Harden demand a trade every 3 months and then pout two weeks after he signs and yet he’s getting all these insane moves whereas Davies is like “yeah I wish my club would prioritize my deal because other clubs are very interested in me” and it’s like he’s stabbing them in the back. 

[Aird25]

14 minutes ago, frmr said:

I think we need some examples of where Davies or the agent have acted in bad faith. The only things I've seen is that the agent has said that many clubs would be interested in the player (true statement) and that negotiations stalled after the reshuffle of Bayern's top brass. I haven't read anything about the agent or player saying anything bad about Bayern, that they want out, etc. Recently Fabrizio posted a quote from the agent saying any rumours of Davies wanting to head to RM are false and that his focus is on Bayern. Players choose not to resign contracts all the time, nothing in bad faith there. If Davies truly wants to join Real Madrid then he needs to just choose not to resign and move on at the right time, while being respectful to Bayern in the process. I'm not sure I've seen anything contrary to that. Also, you say there are "right" and "wrong" ways to conduct business, I would disagree with that. I think there are effective and ineffective ways, and possibly ways that are admirable or not, but there are many ways to skin a cat, so to speak, and just because you personally disagree with certain tactics—which I agree are being overblown—doesn't make them wrong (objectively speaking).

Cheers. This is exactly what I was curious about. As I haven't been following closely, I was mostly asking about specific actions that Davies, his agent, and OneSoccer have taken that are disrespectful or offensive to Bayern and deserving of chastisement. 

[Obinna]

39 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

I don't think this sentimentality is fair to expect from Davies. Sure they bet on Davies, but Davies has held up his end of the bargain (more than expected) and became the best LB in the world. Bayern is I believe the richest club in the world. This next deal that Davies signs will likely be his biggest deal ever unless he signs in the middle east at 30. Bayern publicly says that Davies is one of the faces of their next generation, and yet, behind the scenes, it doesn't seem like they are giving him that level of prioritization.

Davies knows he could go and play on that waterlogged pitch in Jamaica, break his leg and not see the pitch again until he's close to 25. He knows he can get covid again and have it fuck with his heart and affect his level of play. He needs that security to know that his wages and job security are going to be locked in. Bayern is, can, and will use every public trick in the book; calling on Davies' loyalty, hoping that the supporters side with the club over the player, as they usually do, and hope that he stays quiet and plays nice before it affects his marketing value. It's only fair for Davies to use his leverage which is effectively just the fact that he's the best LB in the world and other clubs would love to have him. He may not have that leverage when it's time to sign his next deal, so if it means he has to get dirty with the largest football club on earth to get what's his, so be it. He has one sole responsibility, and that's maximizing what he's getting out of his career before it's too late.

There's also the fact that Davies is a superstar. He does this, Mbappe does this, every intra-premier league transfer target does this, it's what you do when you're this big. We're not talking about Ali Johnston trying to mess with Celtic or Kamal Miller holding out for more money from the only European club that is interested in him. You want the best LB on earth to be in your squad, you give him what he wants. That's it.

Great post - but this part is kind of funny. The guy is currently getting paid (iirc) 11 million euros per season. Obviously he lives a life style most of us can only dream of, but the guy is certainly not hurting for cash at this point (or at least he shouldn't be).

[InglewoodJack]

17 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Great post - but this part is kind of funny. The guy is currently getting paid (iirc) 11 million euros per season. Obviously he lives a life style most of us can only dream of, but the guy is certainly not hurting for cash at this point (or at least he shouldn't be).

Really? Thought it was 5M euros per season, but in any case, it's a lot of money. I just think that when you're at that level, we're talking about goals that the common man can't even fathom. His money needs to maintain his lifestyle for the next 6 or 7 decades, including that of his children and their children in turn. He wants money to invest once he's retired, he wants to ensure that he can live like he does now when he's 70. Chances are there's no one in the entire Davies bloodline who will ever have the earning power Alphonso does, so he has one shot to extract as much money out of his career as he can, and then it's quickly over. On a much lower scale, most Canadians, especially without children can live on a 5 figure salary in Canada and not hurt for cash. If you're really good at what you do and you think you can push your wages to the low six figures, especially if your firm's competitor is ready to offer you those wages, and your boss is giving you the whole "performance reviews are in 9 months and then we'll see!!!", then it's your responsibility to maximize your wages in any way you can. Your boss won't thank your loyalty for taking a cut.

[kacbru]

1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said:

His money needs to maintain his lifestyle for the next 6 or 7 decades, including that of his children and their children in turn. He wants money to invest once he's retired, he wants to ensure that he can live like he does now when he's 70.

Yeah, sucks to be him.  I'm just thankful I only have to worry about money pay-check to pay-check.

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said:

Really? Thought it was 5M euros per season, but in any case, it's a lot of money. I just think that when you're at that level, we're talking about goals that the common man can't even fathom. His money needs to maintain his lifestyle for the next 6 or 7 decades, including that of his children and their children in turn. He wants money to invest once he's retired, he wants to ensure that he can live like he does now when he's 70. Chances are there's no one in the entire Davies bloodline who will ever have the earning power Alphonso does, so he has one shot to extract as much money out of his career as he can, and then it's quickly over. On a much lower scale, most Canadians, especially without children can live on a 5 figure salary in Canada and not hurt for cash. If you're really good at what you do and you think you can push your wages to the low six figures, especially if your firm's competitor is ready to offer you those wages, and your boss is giving you the whole "performance reviews are in 9 months and then we'll see!!!", then it's your responsibility to maximize your wages in any way you can. Your boss won't thank your loyalty for taking a cut.

Oh yeah. I am all for anyone maximizing their earnings, Davies included. It just reads funny, that's all. 

And yeah I thought he was at 5M at one point, but this source (fwiw) says 11.2M (with one year remaining).

https://www.capology.com/club/bayern-munich/salaries/

As you'll see there, he's 11th of 23 on the payroll currently. If you're Davies I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a bump similar to what Coman and de Ligt are earning, at least. Even going just above them would still only put him 8th on the team in terms of pay, which again for the best left back in the world is probably not unreasonable. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Obinna

[InglewoodJack]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

Oh yeah. I am all for anyone maximizing their earnings, Davies included. It just reads funny, that's all. 

And yeah I thought he was at 5M at one point, but this source (fwiw) says 11.2M (with one year remaining).

https://www.capology.com/club/bayern-munich/salaries/

As you'll see there, he's 11th of 23 on the payroll currently. If you're Davies I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a bump similar to what Coman and de Ligt are earning, at least. Even going just above them would still only put him 8th on the team in terms of pay, which again for the best left back in the world is probably not unreasonable. 

Salary ranking is actually a good point to bring up and likely how Davies' camp sees it too. Davies should probably be above Kim and de Ligt salary-wise, and then you have guys like Neuer and Muller who have a year left and will likely both, or at least Neuer, get significant salary reductions due to age. Looking at the list you shared, I think he should fit in somewhere just above Coman in terms of Bayern wage ranking, and once Neuer and Muller's deals expire, he'd be the 6th highest paid player on Bayern which feels right.

[InglewoodJack]

1 hour ago, kacbru said:

Yeah, sucks to be him.  I'm just thankful I only have to worry about money pay-check to pay-check.

Hey, if the place next door to your job told you they'd pay you double and put you on a massive billboard in downtown Madrid, you taking that deal?

[kacbru]

I'm afraid if someone put my face on a massive billboard in Madrid, it would just confuse people.