General Discussion on CMNT

[mpg_29]

16 hours ago, Free kick said:

it will be broadcast live on TSN apparently

Interesting..wonder if they will have the Japan game as well

[RS]

31 minutes ago, mpg_29 said:

Interesting..wonder if they will have the Japan game as well

They won't.

[VinceA]

I just hope Waterman actually sees the pitch at some point.

[Sal333]

19 minutes ago, VinceA said:

I just hope Waterman actually sees the pitch at some point.

Unless he's shortsighted, he'll get an unobstructed gander of the pitch from the bench.

I don't mean to be flippant. Waterman is the next best we have right now but if Waterman sees the pitch that means someone on that back line is hurt.

[Ally McCoist]

Personally I thought Millar looked better than Corbeanu in the friendlies.

[Ivan]

12 hours ago, VinceA said:

I just hope Waterman actually sees the pitch at some point.

I think if Herdman decides to take both Millar and Corbeanu, Waterman would be the guy left off the roster.  Vitoria is going to play all 3 preliminary round games, and if he's healthy for the knockout rounds, he'll keep going.  They'll have Henry and Cornelius in case of injury to Vitoria or Miller.

Anyway, tough decisions, as it should be.

[VinceA]

12 hours ago, Sal333 said:

Unless he's shortsighted, he'll get an unobstructed gander of the pitch from the bench.

I don't mean to be flippant. Waterman is the next best we have right now but if Waterman sees the pitch that means someone on that back line is hurt.

I meant more for the friendlies, just because he has been in multiple camps yet has no caps. I don't exepct hi mto see the pitch in Qatar.

[VinceA]

Gvardiol got concussed and a broken nose for Leipzig.

[Ally McCoist]

For those of you who play FIFA 23

[Shway]

1 hour ago, VinceA said:

Gvardiol got concussed and a broken nose for Leipzig.

Another one. 
This World Cup is beyond a farce with all the injuries happening midseason. 

[red card]

34 minutes ago, Shway said:

Another one. 
This World Cup is beyond a farce with all the injuries happening midseason. 

Athletic's adjusted analysis of Premier League players says it isn't much different than recent seasons if a World Cup was held in the summer.

Has this Prem season been worse? There were 101 soft tissue and muscle injuries recorded during the first 10 weeks of the season (note: not gameweeks), compared to an average of 109.75 over the previous four seasons. Omitting the COVID-19-affected 2020-21 campaign, the average is 99.33 — almost exactly the same as this season.

Sports scientist who previously worked for Man U, Mexico for 2018 and currently with Red Bull says "Until we have the data to show that there are more injuries leading into a winter World Cup, I might even suggest it’s a fallacy. There’s a multitude of factors which contribute to players being injured, which it’s very difficult to try and control or even try to predict.”

A UEFA sports scientist says "“We’ve never seen a World Cup in the middle of the season,” he admits. “This period is usually a heavily congested period, and we do see a slight increase in what we might call preventable injuries — soft tissue damage.”

You’re going to struggle to really buy the winter versus summer argument without a close analysis of sequencing. Personally, I think that the transition from the World Cup back into the club leagues will be that key position. That’s where pundits and the narrative should be focusing on, rather than the lead-up to the tournament.”

https://theathletic.com/3774705/2022/11/09/world-cup-injuries-crisis-fact-fiction/

Edited November 9, 2022 by red card

[Vasi]

Tsn is having a world cup launch at 7:30pm et on tsn 5

[TGAA_Star]

But just having to wait in anticipation for Canada's squad to drop...I mean we're getting anxious here

[Stoppage Time]

2 hours ago, TGAA_Star said:

But just having to wait in anticipation for Canada's squad to drop...I mean we're getting anxious here

I do not anticipate any real surprises. There will be a couple of decisions to make, for instance, perhaps Ugbo versus Corbeanu, or Waterman versus Henry. Is there any one player we are considering who would be a surprise?

 

[Bigandy]

21 minutes ago, Stoppage Time said:

I do not anticipate any real surprises. There will be a couple of decisions to make, for instance, perhaps Ugbo versus Corbeanu, or Waterman versus Henry. Is there any one player we are considering who would be a surprise?

 

-Waterman vs henry vs cornelius... do we take 2 or 3 of them... which ones? I think Henry for sure and corenlius. 
-Ugbo is on the flight and is not in competition with corbeanu 
-Corbeanu, brym, koleosho, millar likely fighting for 1-2 spots. I think this depends on if we take 2 or 3 of the above CB. I think millar is for sure. Corbeanu likely if we dont take waterman 
-Fraser vs oso.... usually they wouldnt be in comparison because they are not like for like. But if Oso cant go, then fraser is our only option at CM to replace him. I think Oso comes.
-fraser for depth? Not with hutch and spoony playing again. if oso comes, he does not.
-some people question spoonys inclusion... i think hes a lock.

Surprises
1. brym- i doubt it
2. Koleosho- injured, not derserving...maybe for a cap tie but i doubt he wants it
3. Injury surprises?
4. If they are not going to the bahrain game, they arent included with any serious intention (euro players excluded obv). That means the only other surprises could be an edwards, choineire  or nelson. I give these guys a 1% chance. no chance we take zbg, who needs 3 RB plus guys who can play wingback. No attackers - shaf, ayo. Brym and corbeanu are clearly ahead. Choineire or nelson have a 1% chance because we have a bit of a mess at CM but each day it sorts itself out more. Fraser is more likely than either of these guys and i doubt he makes it. Edwards gets a shout because sam is our only LB but laryea can play there. Buchanan and davies can as well if theres an emergency.  
 

[BearcatSA]

If Osorio is healthy and there are no other injuries prior to the announcement, for me it boils down to one of these three guys not going:  Miller, Waterman, or Corbeanu.

[Sal333]

4 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

If Osorio is healthy and there are no other injuries prior to the announcement, for me it boils down to one of these three guys not going:  Miller, Waterman, or Corbeanu.

If you mean Liam his name is spelled Millar. I'm sure you didn't mean Kamal.

For me it's Corbeanu. on the outs

[BearcatSA]

1 minute ago, Sal333 said:

If you mean Liam his name is spelled Millar. I'm sure you didn't mean Kamal.

For me it's Corbeanu. on the outs

My bad on the spelling.  Yes, winger Millar.

[Unnamed Trialist]

Don't you think this whole brotherhood loyalty business will have run it's course by the end of this World Cup?

I mean the part where you take players who don't deserve to go on the basis of form for what they do for the dressing room. Or for past services. 

It's an immature and unsustainable model. It's kid's stuff.

We don't need it to qualify for the next World Cup. And it's probably not the way to win a Gold Cup or Nations League. Taking players who aren't at the level undermines the principle of internal competition, suggests to players doing well at their clubs that their good form is secondary, and devalues the goal of beating rivals by being better them position by position. 

Any nation truly aspiring to compete can't be sentimental about it. Ok, this time around,fine. Bit after, we will need something different: the best guys go and the best guys play.

Edited November 10, 2022 by Unnamed Trialist

[El Diego]

3 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Don't you think this whole brotherhood loyalty business will have run it's course by the end of this World Cup?

I mean the part where you take players who don't deserve to go on the basis of form for what they do for the dressing room. Or for past services. 

It's an immature and unsustainable model. It's kid's stuff.

We don't need it to qualify for the next World Cup. And it's probably not the way to win a Gold Cup or Nations League. Taking players who aren't at the level undermines the principle of internal competition, suggests to players doing well at their clubs that their good form is secondary, and devalues the goal of beating rivals by being better them position by position. 

Any nation truly aspiring to compete can't be sentimental about it. Ok, this time around,fine. Bit after, we will need something different: the best guys go and the best guys play.

I think you're exactly right.  Ok, we had an insular mentality for 2022 that I think helped us qualify, but after that tournament we start afresh. Everyone should be of the understanding that basically no one carries over goodwill from 2022 going forward, as harsh as that may sound.

[dyslexic nam]

4 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Don't you think this whole brotherhood loyalty business will have run it's course by the end of this World Cup?

I mean the part where you take players who don't deserve to go on the basis of form for what they do for the dressing room. Or for past services. 

It's an immature and unsustainable model. It's kid's stuff.

We don't need it to qualify for the next World Cup. And it's probably not the way to win a Gold Cup or Nations League. Taking players who aren't at the level undermines the principle of internal competition, suggests to players doing well at their clubs that their good form is secondary, and devalues the goal of beating rivals by being better them position by position. 

Any nation truly aspiring to compete can't be sentimental about it. Ok, this time around,fine. Bit after, we will need something different: the best guys go and the best guys play.

If the rumors are to believed, there are also different factions for some of the dealings with CSA - largely based on earning power.  If that is the case, I suspect Herdman is trying to sustain the fraternity mantra to maintain the highest level of cohesion possible for the WC.  After that, like many super-motivational factors that are more effective as time-limited things, it will probably have run its course.  

[jhoops__]

guys on the bottom of the roster will have little impact on the pitch.  However,  I do think that bringing in young guys like Corbeanu and even Koleosho makes sense for the future..,

[Bigandy]

23 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Don't you think this whole brotherhood loyalty business will have run it's course by the end of this World Cup?

I mean the part where you take players who don't deserve to go on the basis of form for what they do for the dressing room. Or for past services. 

It's an immature and unsustainable model. It's kid's stuff.

We don't need it to qualify for the next World Cup. And it's probably not the way to win a Gold Cup or Nations League. Taking players who aren't at the level undermines the principle of internal competition, suggests to players doing well at their clubs that their good form is secondary, and devalues the goal of beating rivals by being better them position by position. 

Any nation truly aspiring to compete can't be sentimental about it. Ok, this time around,fine. Bit after, we will need something different: the best guys go and the best guys play.

I agree that we should expand and pick the best squad but just playing devils advocate. What if the brotherhood/loyalty business results in a better team than simply picking the best players? 
you have experience - understanding of the tactical expectations, different systems etc.

there are no trouble makers in the group - strong group cohesion

In our case, who are the beneficiaries of the brotherhood - Henry and kaye

Who takes henrys spot - mcnaughton or james are the only real options IF cornelius and waterman all go. Otherwise the real option is whoever doesnt go between cornelius and waterman.  If henry comes as our 5th-6th choice cb, then we get great leadership/vibes in the room. Most likely thats a better contribution to the group than what waterman would give you if they both sit on the bench all tournament. Henry also offers a physical presence that no one else does. Even though the brotherhood is very much helping henry, he does offer value to the squad. Last minute and we are holding onto a lead, henry may be an option to man mark a lukaku type striker or deal with aerially balls? 

Kaye - he has to come out of necessity. an out of form kaye is still a safer pick with his experience with the group and playing internationally. I pick kaye as a 6th string guy compared to choiniere or an out of form fraser any day and its not because of the brotherhood. 

Anyone else im forgetting about who is benefitting from the brotherhood? 

Its a really interesting debate because our depth is really hit and miss but we have so much potential. Would love to hear which players you think are benefitting and who should replace them at this world cup?

[Unnamed Trialist]

7 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

I agree that we should expand and pick the best squad but just playing devils advocate. What if the brotherhood/loyalty business results in a better team than simply picking the best players? 
you have experience - understanding of the tactical expectations, different systems etc.

there are no trouble makers in the group - strong group cohesion

In our case, who are the beneficiaries of the brotherhood - Henry and kaye

Who takes henrys spot - mcnaughton or james are the only real options IF cornelius and waterman all go. Otherwise the real option is whoever doesnt go between cornelius and waterman.  If henry comes as our 5th-6th choice cb, then we get great leadership/vibes in the room. Most likely thats a better contribution to the group than what waterman would give you if they both sit on the bench all tournament. Henry also offers a physical presence that no one else does. Even though the brotherhood is very much helping henry, he does offer value to the squad. Last minute and we are holding onto a lead, henry may be an option to man mark a lukaku type striker or deal with aerially balls? 

Kaye - he has to come out of necessity. an out of form kaye is still a safer pick with his experience with the group and playing internationally. I pick kaye as a 6th string guy compared to choiniere or an out of form fraser any day and its not because of the brotherhood. 

Anyone else im forgetting about who is benefitting from the brotherhood? 

Its a really interesting debate because our depth is really hit and miss but we have so much potential. Would love to hear which players you think are benefitting and who should replace them at this world cup?

I think you are right that it only affects the periphery. Lucky they let us take 26 players, if it were 23 we'd be leaving off some real talent to accomodate Henry, especially (the Kennedy injury notwithstanding).

The important thing is that Herdman has repeated a few times that stat about how many players you need in top 5 leagues to get out of a WC group. So he has that in mind, though he's not a player agent. He knows we need to have a core in the top 5 leagues, like the US does at least. He was also clear right after qualifying about players needing to step up and aspire to higher levels, which I think was a motivator for Laryea to go to NF and perhaps for others to try to improve their club situation. 

I am hopeful he'll be ready to move on and try a different motivational tack. I am also hopeful he'll focus in on winning a Nations League or Gold Cup. At least getting to a final and giving ourselves a chance. Getting closer to the US and Mexico in ranking and finding a way to get into their exclusive Gold Cup club.

[trc2014]

53 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

I mean the part where you take players who don't deserve to go on the basis of form for what they do for the dressing room. Or for past services. 

It's an immature and unsustainable model. It's kid's stuff.

Don’t think I agree that having ‘locker room guys’ is kids stuff.  Every team has players that aren’t going to play that gel the team together, motivate, etc., this is not Canada unique.  Teams normally play less than 20 players at the WC, a number of players know they aren’t going to see the field unless there is a real disaster, and the guys who work that role make the team (ie why Steffen was left off the US squad).