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56 minutes ago, Gopherbashi said:

Are we talking "loaned to play in MLS" or "loaned to an MLS team who promptly sent them to USL"?

Loaned to play in MLS.

I think the only time a loan to MLS included a USL stint was Martinez in Columbus last year and that was after he made 3 appearances with Columbus before being sent to Pittsburgh.

Gonna make a detailed list from 2012-17

Edited by matty
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Here's a list with details based on Wikipedia. Not including loans from Liga MX or USL to MLS. CONCACAF only. Might be missing some

It does seem a few have involved USL loans but it is the minority

2012

- Mario Martínez loaned from Real España (Hon) to Seattle Sounders for 2012-13. Played 13 games

- Chris Klute loaned from Atlanta Silverbacks (NASL) to Colorado Rapids for 2012-13. Played 18 games before joining club full time in 2013.

2013

- Marcos Sánchez loaned from Tauro (Pan) to DC United. Played 9 games

- Alvas Powell loaned from Portmore United (Jam) to Portland Timbers for 2013-14. Played 20 games, scored 2 goals, loaned down to USL in 2014, joined club full time in 2015.
- Mark Bloom loaned from Atlanta Silverbacks (NASL) to Toronto FC. Played 6 games, joined club full time.

2014

-Brian Brown loaned from Harbour View (Jam) to Philadelphia Union. Played 8 games, scored 2 goals

2015

- Deybi Flores loaned from Motagua (Hon) to Vancouver Whitecaps. Played 9 games, loaned to USL, joined club full time

- Daneil Cyrus loaned from W Connection (TnT) to Chicago Fire. Played 4 games

- Jordan Smith loaned from Saprissa (CR) to Vancouver Whitecaps for 2015-16. Played 24 games

- John Smits loaned from FC Edmonton (NASL) to Montreal Impact. Did not play

2016

-Cristian Martínez loaned from Chorrillo (Pan) to Columbus Crew. Played 5 games, scored a goal, loaned to USL, joined club full time.

-Keyner Brown loaned from Herediano (CR) to Houston Dynamo. Played 4 games

-Armando Cooper loaned from Árabe Unido (Pan) to Toronto FC. Played 6 games, joined club full time.

- José Escalante loaned from Olimpia (Hon) to Houston Dynamo. Played 5 games, did a USL stint. ACTIVE STILL

2017 (active)

- Michael Amir Murillo loaned from San Francisco (Pan) to NYRB. Played 8 games, scored a goal has been loaned to RB2.

- Fidel Escobar loaned from Sporting San Miguelito (Pan) to NYRB. Has not played

- José Guillermo Ortiz loaned from Herediano (CR) to DC United. Has played 16 games, scored a goal

- Miguel Camargo loaned from Chorrillo (Pan) to NYCFC. Played 8 games, scored a goal

Providers
Panama - 6
Costa Rica - 3
NASL - 3
Honduras - 3
Jamaica - 2
Trinidad and Tobago - 1

Joined Full Time - 6/18

Total MLS games - 163

Loaned to USL as well - 5

Edited by matty
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3 hours ago, Rheo said:

Edmonton FC GM Jay Ball had a handful of interesting tweets last night talking about transfer fees and the influence the CPL will have.  It's under the tweets and replies banner since it was a question to him

https://twitter.com/JayBallYeg

WTF, it seems like you can't view the "Tweets and Replies" section anymore unless you are signed in to an account.

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Spoilers****

Kurt Larson points out that CPL must avoid becoming the league who accepts MLS players who were cut.

My wrestling analogy to this, don't be the TNA to WWE:(...Be ROH (Ring of Honor) or Old ECW (with better management) :D

Edited by Ansem
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*****Spoilers

3 things that caught my attention:

  1. Number of internationals being discussed/planned/pitched is 10
  2. Duane Rollins replied to Kurt Larson question on quality of play. Brands it "MLS 1.0". Adds that current MLS (2.0) took 20 years. He doubts CPL takes 20 years as well to reach that point
  3. Theory about why CPL won't use mainstream media. Independent journalists are more likely to hype CPL and keep hyping it while mainstream media is more likely to downplay/pour some water on the hype. If that's the case, it's a smart approach by the league until their official press conference
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3 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Spoilers****

Kurt Larson points out that CPL must avoid becoming the league who accepts MLS players who were cut.

My wrestling analogy to this, don't be the TNA to WWE:(...Be ROH (Ring of Honor) or Old ECW (with better management) :D

Okay, that’s cool and all, but Canada has a LOT of quality players that were at one point MLS journeymen.

For example (they’re all French-Canadian examples, sorry):

Zakarria Messoudi (Odds BK), Karl Ouimette (San Fran Deltas), Maxim Tissot (San Fran Deltas), Jérémy Gagnon-Laparé (AS Vitré), Aron Mkungilwa (Ottawa Fury), etc...

All played for the Impact or their academy, and were cut. These guys are all doing well, are eligible for national team rotation and have club careers. All of them are better players than anyone in the PLSQ or L1O (having never seen an L1O game, I’m just assuming the two semi-pro leagues are comparable).

If we’re excluding them, who are we including?

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11 hours ago, harrycoyster said:

How many of those were loans with options to buy? Because those cases are more "we'll buy them but we want a return policy" than loans.

Don't have that info but I do suspect it's a good amount as buys have happened almost 1/3 of the time.

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12 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Spoilers****

Kurt Larson points out that CPL must avoid becoming the league who accepts MLS players who were cut.

 

In the long term I agree with this, but guys who are just below MLS will be clear candidates for early CPL rosters.  I use the example of someone like Bekker.  Deemed surplus at Montreal, now playing for SF Deltas, and has the kind of quality required to make early CPL a really enjoyable league to watch.  To me, there is nothing wrong with CPL grabbing that kind of Canadian content - especially at the outset when the challenge will be to populate a whole pro league (up to the quota) with domestic talent. 

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15 minutes ago, ChrisinOrleans said:

Okay, that’s cool and all, but Canada has a LOT of quality players that were at one point MLS journeymen.

For example (they’re all French-Canadian examples, sorry):

Zakarria Messoudi (Odds BK), Karl Ouimette (San Fran Deltas), Maxim Tissot (San Fran Deltas), Jérémy Gagnon-Laparé (AS Vitré), Aron Mkungilwa (Ottawa Fury), etc...

All played for the Impact or their academy, and were cut. These guys are all doing well, are eligible for national team rotation and have club careers. All of them are better players than anyone in the PLSQ or L1O (having never seen an L1O game, I’m just assuming the two semi-pro leagues are comparable).

If we’re excluding them, who are we including?

I hear you.

  • Safe to say that trying to convince/buy/rent Canadians playing in D1 and D2 leagues around the world would be step 1. (Paul Beirne in the Q&A in Halifax said the league would deem D3 too low)
  • Step 2  MLS journeymen as you say who would be bought/loaned (still playing in MLS like Osorio)
  • Step 3 Buy/ Loan NASL/USL players and those who were cut from MLS (Like Bekker-Tissot-Hamilton)
  • Step 4 D3 (PLSQ-L1O) -->players ready for the next level only and those who got cut (Q.Roberts)

Just an assumption...Question is, how far down the steps will they need to go to fill their rosters?

***Reminder that the number of internationals being thrown according to Rollins is now 10. The majority of those 10 internationals would be your starters a majority of the time and being subbed in most of the time too

Edited by Ansem
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17 minutes ago, Ansem said:

I hear you.

  • Safe to say that trying to convince/buy/rent Canadians playing in D1 and D2 leagues around the world would be step 1. (Paul Beirne in the Q&A in Halifax said the league would deem D3 too low)
  • Step 2  MLS journeymen as you say who would be bought/loaned (still playing in MLS like Osorio)
  • Step 3 Buy/ Loan NASL/USL players and those who were cut from MLS (Like Bekker-Tissot-Hamilton)
  • Step 4 D3 (PLSQ-L1O) -->players ready for the next level only and those who got cut (Q.Roberts)

Just an assumption...Question is, how far down the steps will they need to go to fill their rosters?

***Reminder that the number of internationals being thrown according to Rollins is now 10. The majority of those 10 internationals would be your starters a majority of the time and being subbed in most of the time too

Alright, so if D1 and D2 is the cut-off (if D3 is too low) then the available player pool from the province of Québec eligible to play in CanPL would be: 

Karl Ouimette, Maxim Tissot, Zakkaria Messoudi (Odds is Norwegian D1), Olivier Occéan, Patrice Bernier, Samuel Piette, David Chonière, Wandrille Lefèvre, Anthony Jackson-Hamel, Maxime Crépeau and Louis Béland-Goyette. Most of those are not going to leave IMFC, so that reduces the availability of a few. 

Those that are excluded are André Hainault (German D3), Jon Bealieu-Borgault (German D3 and PLSQ), Jérémy Gagnon-Laparé (French D3), Phillipe Davies (PLSQ after NASL), and Haidar Al-Shabani (French D4).

That seems like bizarre logic to me, given that three weeks ago Samuel Piette was in the Spanish 3rd division and on the national team, yet Wandoo hasn't played a game in months but would be given preference over Piette? Messoudi has played like 4 games for Odds BK in the Norwegian top flight, and would be given a shot in CanPL over Hainault - an experienced MNT veteran - because of a D1 status? 

Am I off base in this assumption?  

 

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