CPL General

[lazlo_80]

31 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Lenarduzzi interview

https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/whitecaps-president-robinson-firing-time-move/

Good stuff at the 9:00 mark

Pretty much defending the low spending philosophy of the Whitecaps when being challenged on that. Don't know if it's unwillingness or inability to spend at the level of the top clubs but what's the point in staying in MLS if you know that you'll only get the cup by pulling a "Leicester City" type of miracle? How will you be able to sell that to fans and for how long? He's kind of being challenged there too.

He's pointing out to leagues around the world where the giants are spending the money while the others do the best they can with their limited resources. Does Vancouver wants to be an "MLS minnow or CPL powerhouse"? More importantly, what would the fans rather see for their team? In the end, it comes down to that in my opinion.

I'm starting to think that in the long term, only TFC can keep up with the rest of MLS. Saputo in Montreal is already tied up with Bologna in Serie A and have terrible TV ratings and inconsistent attendances (they are called  out by Garber from time to time).

I'm still of the opinion that CPL, long term,  will become a more viable place where they can

• Run the clubs with their preferred level of spending AND dominate the league like a "Real Madrid - Barcelona - Atletico Madrid" standing situation in La Liga -- which drives up sales for winning, getting cups and going to Champions League
• Spending in Canadian dollars
• Have meaningful rivalries, which also drives up sale. (Montreal vs Quebec - Vancouver vs Surrey & Victoria - Toronto vs the rest of Ontario)
• Drives up merchandise sales
• Boost the league value (TV, reputation etc...) and allow it to reach it's true potential.

I'm sorry but MLS is moving fast towards 3.0 and only going UP. I don't think Vancouver and Montreal will keep up. I think for CPL and CSA, all they need to do is to wait it out until CPL starts to make more sense to them.

I agree with a ton of what you're saying. I still think Montreal and Vancouver can keep up if they find ways to keep people interested and be more responsible with their spending (there's a good number of teams on lower pay scale that do great job of being consistently competitive)

The problem with CPL right now is that based on what we're hearing it's far below what Montreal and Vancouver have and by the sounds of it, being held back further by owners with even smaller pockets. Ironically they'd likely flip roles and become behemoths held back by a league unwilling to catch up to them. 

The onus is on the CPL to prove they have as big of plans as they sometimes say they do. Right now they're speaking out of both sides of their mouth and the operating budgets we're hearing about are underwhelming.

[Ansem]

44 minutes ago, Initial B said:

TFC won't leave MLS because they're backed by the Rogers consortium and the team provides content for their platforms.

Emphasis on "LONG TERM" and I will add IF CPL GROWS TO 2.0

It isn't up to Rogers but the CSA. I did mention TFC was the only club that could keep up but cast my doubts on the other 2 teams. Losing constantly doesn't sell either and that's what the consortium cares the most about.

44 minutes ago, Initial B said:

Montreal won't leave MLS because Joey's ego won't let him and he knows that the current supporters will see TFC is in MLS and won't put up with less than major league quality of play.

Emphasis on "LONG TERM" and I will add IF CPL GROWS TO 2.0

Bologna is Saputo's baby. He said himself he has yet to make a profit, let alone breaking even. I just don't see Montreal Impact spending to the level of other clubs once the league hits 3.0. It's already bad now, imagine when MLB comes back into town bringing the Expos nostalgia... Mediocrity in MLS could be lethal. They need to win, PERIOD or people won't care unless you give them a reason too.

44 minutes ago, Initial B said:

Vancouver probably won't leave MLS due to the Cascadia Rivalry and Canada needs a western team that aspires to the highest level of play.

Emphasis on "LONG TERM" and I will add IF CPL GROWS TO 2.0

That rivalry doesn't stop fans from reconsidering spending on the Caps. I doubt that outside Vancouver Metro (being generous here), Western Canada cares about MLS or the Cascadia Rivalry

44 minutes ago, Initial B said:

Bob did a great sidestep at 4:15 when asked why he still had a job after only 1 playoff appearance in 5 years.  The interviewer was a bit disingenuous when he grouped Sporting KC and Portland as teams that spend - neither of them are top third in spending and yet they've won MLS cups. It's an organizational deficiency with the Caps that they haven't been successful. I really hope they get Dos Santos in there as coach.

The worry isn't about now. The interviewer was accurately implying that spending will keep going up and that Vancouver will find themselves becoming the minnow of MLS. Angry fans are reconsidering now, imagine then! You can win the MLS Cup NOW on a low budget but once MLS hits 3.0, forget about it unless you recreate a "Leicester City" run which will be highly unlikely in my opinion.

MLS will hit 3.0...question is, will Montreal and Vancouver hit 3.0 spending? Doubt it. I have serious doubts about Vancouver, but Montrealers sees themselves as a "World Class sport city", I'd like to think that Vancouver residents sees themselves as such. This is where Lenarduzzi has it all wrong. Using Columbus and Kansas City is plain wrong. Those cities are fully aware they aren't LA or NYC, so expecting Montrealers and Vancouver to view themselves as such is how you can tell where this is heading if there isn't a change in philosophy.

Expecting fans accept losing and mediocrity years after years would be a monumental mistake. Those fans started to desert the Habs at the Bell Centre, won't take that long for Montreal if they become MLS minnow in a context where you have Laval and Quebec contesting for Cups and Champions League spots with local french speaking talent... Good luck with that Saputo.

Edited September 26, 2018 by Ansem

[Ansem]

28 minutes ago, lazlo_80 said:

I agree with a ton of what you're saying. I still think Montreal and Vancouver can keep up if they find ways to keep people interested and be more responsible with their spending (there's a good number of teams on lower pay scale that do great job of being consistently competitive)

The problem with CPL right now is that based on what we're hearing it's far below what Montreal and Vancouver have and by the sounds of it, being held back further by owners with even smaller pockets. Ironically they'd likely flip roles and become behemoths held back by a league unwilling to catch up to them. 

The onus is on the CPL to prove they have as big of plans as they sometimes say they do. Right now they're speaking out of both sides of their mouth and the operating budgets we're hearing about are underwhelming.

I agree with you. I think CPL could hit 2.0 after the 2026 World Cup, using that tournament as a launching pad to the next level, coinciding with the launch of D2 and pro/rel. The spot light will be on soccer and CPL. Until then, there's no way that the 3 MLS teams going to CPL makes sense.

Also, I think that the league giving themselves the time to get to 2.0 is reasonable. They have big plans for the future, which they keep hammering but I don't think they pretended to have them as of year 1. The highest ceiling on big plan I've heard in regards to year 1 from Clanachan was that he believed that CPL could be above USL as of year 1. I don't think it's unrealistic, and then to grow from there at what I believe a much faster rate than USL.

I just think that, however it happens and whenever it happens, the 3 teams ends up in CPL if it doesn't fold or stagnates. If the growth continues, they will reach a point where it starts to make sense.

Edited September 26, 2018 by Ansem

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

32 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Emphasis on "LONG TERM" and I will add IF CPL GROWS TO 2.0...

Assuming they make it through the first few years, which is no sure thing for any new sports league, the more they expand into smallish 200-500k type markets or outer suburbs of the larger cities in the years ahead rather than having more franchises playing in CFL stadia the less likely they are to be in any way comparable to MLS. Beyond that under single entity MLS collectively owns 51% (?) of each of the Canadian franchises, so a huge part of what will unfold in the decades ahead will be whether being in the three biggest Canadian markets is a net positive for the league overall. If not, the Columbus to Austin type of scenario might get repeated at some point, which would not be good for Canadian soccer if it meant losing the level of investment that has been going into the Academy systems.

Edited September 26, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Ansem]

13 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Assuming they make it through the first few years, which is no sure thing for any new sports league, the more they expand into smallish 200-500k type markets or outer suburbs of the larger cities in the years ahead rather than having more franchises playing in CFL stadia the less likely they are to be in any way comparable to MLS.

I wonder how Euro leagues with teams in smaller markets pulls it off... There's not a "one all, be all" way to grow a success.

13 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Beyond that under single entity MLS collectively owns 51% of each of the Canadian franchises, so a huge part of what will unfold in the decades ahead will be whether being in the three biggest Canadian markets is a net positive for the league.

Outside of Toronto, the other 2 are pretty much small fries compared to some existing media markets trying to get into the league. What will MLS do once they hit saturation and they still have bigger markets willing to break the bank to get in compared to the $40M both Montreal and Vancouver paid to get in?

You got you math wrong here.

Also, what will the USSF do in a scenario where Canada challenges the USMNT for regional supremacy? Will they put up with their pyramid contributing directly into building up a foe capable of beating them in CONCACAF, Copa America, Olympic tournaments, WCQ and the World Cup itself? They are fine with status quo as long as we're no threat. Once that changes, not sure they put up with us in their pyramid when CPL and some regional leagues exists. They won't care what MLS will want at that point in time.

13 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

 If not, the Columbus to Austin scenario might get repeated at some point, which would not be good for Canadian soccer if it meant losing the level of investment that has been going into the Academy systems.

Not sure I get what you're talking about here. You'll have to elaborate

Edited September 26, 2018 by Ansem

[RS]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

Also, what will the USSF do in a scenario where Canada challenges the USMNT for regional supremacy? Will they put up with their pyramid contributing directly into building up a foe capable of beating them in CONCACAF, Copa America, Olympic tournaments, WCQ and the World Cup itself? They are fine with status quo as long as we're no threat. Once that changes, not sure they put up with us in their pyramid when CPL and some regional leagues exists. They won't care what MLS will want at that point in time.

The USSF won't do a thing.

SUM and USSF are intertwined, the Canadian teams provide value to MLS. The league is going to top out at 30-32 teams, so three teams in Canada, all that have traditionally had a lot of American representation on the field, isn't going to make or break the USMNT.

[Ansem]

41 minutes ago, RS said:

The USSF won't do a thing.

SUM and USSF are intertwined, the Canadian teams provide value to MLS. The league is going to top out at 30-32 teams, so three teams in Canada, all that have traditionally had a lot of American representation on the field, isn't going to make or break the USMNT.

My example was very specific. Pre 90s, we used to beat the USMNT more often. In fact, they couldn't qualify for a world cup as soon as we started sending teams to qualifiers. 

It was done before and could be done again. If that happen, I doubt the USSF stays inactive.

[Complete Homer]

https://mobile.twitter.com/York9fc/status/1045061890009747456

Too soon for a reboot? York9 is having another launch party

They are also hiring ticket reps for anyone interested in that line of work

[Blackjack15]

1 hour ago, Complete Homer said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/York9fc/status/1045061890009747456

Too soon for a reboot? York9 is having another launch party

They are also hiring ticket reps for anyone interested in that line of work

Saw on Twitter as well that late November the first players of the club should be announced 

[CDNFootballer]

21 hours ago, Keegan said:

https://twitter.com/sir_reynolds_

This USL player Sean Reynolds is going off on the league.  Gives you a picture of how low budget the operation really is/has been - I don't think us expecting a similar level is unrealistic at all.  

Danny Szetela on USL wages :

.@DSzetela14 On The USL: "There was some offers but they weren't great ones in the USL. Could have been making more money at a fast food restaurant".

[RS]

4 hours ago, Ansem said:

My example was very specific. Pre 90s, we used to beat the USMNT more often. In fact, they couldn't qualify for a world cup as soon as we started sending teams to qualifiers. 

It was done before and could be done again. If that happen, I doubt the USSF stays inactive.

I'm aware of the USMNT's history, and it doesn't change my mind.

When there's money to be made, that takes precedence. Don Garber sits on the USSF board for a reason.

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, RS said:

I'm aware of the USMNT's history, and it doesn't change my mind.

When there's money to be made, that takes precedence. Don Garber sits on the USSF board for a reason.

Sure... doesn't change that the CSA ultimately has the last say

[RS]

2 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Sure... doesn't change that the CSA ultimately has the last say

What? You were talking about the USSF getting petty with the Canadian MLS teams if Canada challenges the USMNT on the field. What does the CSA have to do with this discussion?

Either way, neither federation is going to force the Canadian teams out of MLS. You might as well get that idea out of your head now.

[Ansem]

6 hours ago, RS said:

What? You were talking about the USSF getting petty with the Canadian MLS teams if Canada challenges the USMNT on the field. What does the CSA have to do with this discussion?

Petty? I'm saying that in the eventuality that Canada edges the US regionally and on the global stage, people down there are going to wonder and ask the USSF:

"Why are we allowing Canadian clubs in our pyramid and directly helping them improving their program by developing players using our developmental structure?"

Did you missed the news when the USMNT missed the 2018 World Cup??? I watched most of the analyst down there losing their collective minds over missing Russia. In the last USSF election, a candidate did raise the question of why Canadian clubs were allowed in MLS.

Analysts were criticizing MLS on how it contributed to the improvement of their regional opponents at their expense.

You think that in a scenario where we eliminate them from a World cup berth, beat them in a major tournament and surpass them, that the USSF won't be facing heavy criticism and scrutiny? The CPL existence and the possible launch of a D2 post 2026, makes the whole exercise harder to justify.

Stop this thinking that Garber is the GOD of US Soccer. The league has influence, sure, but there are limits to how far and at what price the USSF is willing to let them do whatever they want. You never know who could take over the USSF and under which circumstances which could flip the whole thing upside down.

Never say never, crazier things has happens. If Trump can get in the white house, not much can surprise me these days... especially from down there.

6 hours ago, RS said:

Either way, neither federation is going to force the Canadian teams out of MLS. You might as well get that idea out of your head now.

Canadian clubs in a US league is only possible when all parties agrees under FIFA convention and under strict circumstances. You only need either the CSA, USSF, CONCACAF or FIFA to step in to put the whole thing in question.

It's not about forcing them out, however, as it's been said many times, such arrangements MUST be justified. This is why lots of people are skeptical on Ottawa getting sanctioned by the CSA indefinitely outside the Canadian pyramid with the existance of CPL and at some point CPL 2 if they even get to stay in USL that long. The justification simply wouldn't be there.

The growth of CPL and a D2 launch would only make it harder to justify keeping the status quo. Just as much as you're saying that "it will never happen", you'd need CPL to fold or crazy long time stagnation for your "never scenario" to happen. If the league succeeds, it will eventually grow to a point where it starts to make sense to raise the issues and harder to justify to not talk about it.

Edited September 27, 2018 by Ansem

[Blackjack15]

With the latest announcement (Set of news) The USSF think they’ve made history, like no all you’ve done is renamed the divisions into Championship, League One and League Two 

By re-branding nothing special has been done from previously before 

The real fans know that PDL is a league for U23’s and that the new league just formed and that USL remains the same  

However since their isn’t promotion relegation among 4 Tiers it’s tricking and eye catching to the casual fan who will ask themselves this question 

They just copied this from England

 

[matty]

Hey guys any big updates, beyond Macron? Been crazy busy the last like week and a half

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

6 hours ago, Ansem said:

Sure... doesn't change that the CSA ultimately has the last say

The Canadian legal system has last say as the CSA found out when they removed sanctioning from the CSL and that also applies in the US as well as the USSF are finding out where the NASL is concerned. Something to bear in mind beyond that is that CSA policy isn't carved in stone and has oscillated on this national league question over the years. For a decade or so now it has been possible for people to project their preferred aspirations onto having a new domestic pro league. Once it's up and running, however, people will have to deal with mundane reality.

As things are unfolding at the moment they could easily find (if the information emanating from Ottawa was accurate) that Canadian teams are going to be offering burger flipping level money to many/most players in a similar manner to some of the filler content of the USL but the difference will be that it will be at a level sanctioned as D1 rather than D2 . Historically the grass has tended to start looking greener on the other side of the fence again when direct comparisons of that type can be made given the United States has ten times the population that Canada does making it easier to do things on a larger scale than is possible in a Canada only context.

There's a definite niche for a Canadian league that is affordable in markets in the 200-750k range with heavy domestic roster content and I very much hope it works, but there's also a definite niche in the 1.5 million + markets for something genuinely major league or close to it in a AAA baseball sort of way as well and that's a lot more likely to happen in a cross-border context.

Edited September 27, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The Canadian legal system has last say as the CSA found out when they removed sanctioning from the CSL (that also applies in the US as well as the USSF are finding out where the NASL is concerned).

Yet, the CSA still got what they wanted... unsanction of the CSL. The CSL challenged it and they lost.

Courts are very reluctant in creating precedents at ruling on leagues/sports organizations convention. You already know all of this but I guess you just can't help yourself 

1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Something to bear in mind beyond that is that CSA policy isn't carved in stone and has oscillated on this national league question over the years. For a decade or so now it has been possible for people to project their preferred aspirations onto having a new domestic pro league. Once it's up and running, however, people will have to deal with mundane reality.

You mean you... Noted. 

1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

As things are unfolding at the moment they could easily find (if the information emanating from Ottawa was accurate) that Canadian teams are going to be offering burger flipping level money to many/most players in a similar manner to some of the filler content of the USL but the difference will be that it will be at a level sanctioned as D1 rather than D2 . Historically the grass has tended to start looking greener on the other side of the fence again when direct comparisons of that type can be made given the United States has ten times the population that Canada does making it easier to do things on a larger scale than is possible in a Canada only context.

We have a word for that in French. My fellow francophones will understand it. "Colonisé"

You conveniently exclude countries smaller than us that have successful domestic leagues and countries who also have such league on massive territories. You're reaching here.

Burger flipping salaries? That's USL players saying that about their league as we've seen on twitter. You're allowed to believe some "Fury Fanatic" if it fits your narrative. I'll stick with Montagliani when he said that players will be able to earn living wage and have a career, which the league and multiple more "credible" sources also implied.

1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

There's a definite niche for a Canadian league that is affordable in markets in the 200-750k range with heavy domestic roster content and I very much hope it works, but there's also a definite niche in the 1.5 million + markets for something genuinely major league or close to it in a AAA baseball sort of way as well and that's a lot more likely to happen in a cross-border context.

Comparing soccer "a global sport" and it's unique global structure to American leagues where sports are mainly American isn't even worth my time or my brain power.

 

[MtlMario]

3 hours ago, Ansem said:

Yet, the CSA still got what they wanted... unsanction of the CSL. The CSL challenged it and they lost.

Courts are very reluctant in creating precedents at ruling on leagues/sports organizations convention. You already know all of this but I guess you just can't help yourself 

You mean you... Noted. 

We have a word for that in French. My fellow francophones will understand it. "Colonisé"

You conveniently exclude countries smaller than us that have successful domestic leagues and countries who also have such league on massive territories. You're reaching here.

Burger flipping salaries? That's USL players saying that about their league as we've seen on twitter. You're allowed to believe some "Fury Fanatic" if it fits your narrative. I'll stick with Montagliani when he said that players will be able to earn living wage and have a career, which the league and multiple more "credible" sources also implied.

Comparing soccer "a global sport" and it's unique global structure to American leagues where sports are mainly American isn't even worth my time or my brain power.

 

First it was the CPL won't happen, now the CPL will have shitty wages. Why do you waste your time with him. He's always going to look at the negative side of things.

[soccerlife]

54 minutes ago, MtlMario said:

First it was the CPL won't happen, now the CPL will have shitty wages. Why do you waste your time with him. He's always going to look at the negative side of things.

That is too funny.  I had the same thought as I was reading the post.  BBTB finally got on board that the CPL is happening, now he needs to find another way to bash it. Too bad BBTB only listens to people from Ottawa about the wages.  Ottawa folks want people to believe their story to make it more credible as to why they are not joining the league.  I find it interesting that Fury Fanatic (or somebody) said Ottawa was for sure in the league for 2020-22 area.  What will change for  them to do that?  Anyway, I don't believe the wages will be at $500,000. 

[Kent]

9 hours ago, Blackjack15 said:

With the latest announcement (Set of news) The USSF think they’ve made history, like no all you’ve done is renamed the divisions into Championship, League One and League Two 

By re-branding nothing special has been done from previously before 

The real fans know that PDL is a league for U23’s and that the new league just formed and that USL remains the same  

However since their isn’t promotion relegation among 4 Tiers it’s tricking and eye catching to the casual fan who will ask themselves this question 

They just copied this from England

 

Oh man, I had ignored that news and hadn't clicked on any of the articles. I can't believe they copied that naming convention, which in my opinion is the most idiotic naming convention in all of sports leagues. I really hope if CPL ever realizes their dream of having a 2nd division, that they don't call it the Championship. CPL2, C2L, or CDL (Deuxieme) or something like that would be much, much better.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

1 hour ago, MtlMario said:

First it was the CPL won't happen, now the CPL will have shitty wages...

^^^Obviously wasn't even reading my posts properly because having lower budgets similar to the salary cap of the old CSL in the 1980s rather than operating with an 8000 crowd as break even was a big part of what I was suggesting they should do to make it actually happen and last longer than being one and done. What wasn't going to happen was the big budget rival to MLS some people on here and elsewhere were fantasizing about.

If the 500k salary cap thing is accurate and the rhetoric from Paul Beirne last summer about aiming to have a league that can work in any market sized 200k and above to make the league easily expandable with teams in relatively small stadia was genuine then they are doing pretty much what I used to argue they should do on here with the unfortunate exception of the MLS affiliate angle. MLS affiliates could have got them to 8 much more easily for the launch and also would probably have got them a team in Quebec by now, but they've set out their stall without that so hopefully they'll still be able to get enough stable franchises together to make it work.

[RS]

11 hours ago, Ansem said:

It's not about forcing them out, however, as it's been said many times, such arrangements MUST be justified. This is why lots of people are skeptical on Ottawa getting sanctioned by the CSA indefinitely outside the Canadian pyramid with the existance of CPL and at some point CPL 2 if they even get to stay in USL that long. The justification simply wouldn't be there.

The growth of CPL and a D2 launch would only make it harder to justify keeping the status quo. Just as much as you're saying that "it will never happen", you'd need CPL to fold or crazy long time stagnation for your "never scenario" to happen. If the league succeeds, it will eventually grow to a point where it starts to make sense to raise the issues and harder to justify to not talk about it.

I'm only responding to this part as I don't have all day to do a line-by-line rebut on a rant, but you initially implied that either the USSF or the CSA could/would force the three MLS teams to move out of MLS (which, by letter of the law, they can but it's not realistic at all) , then when I said that neither will do so you'd shifted the narrative to whether it will happen if the CPL is successful enough to justify the teams moving.

If that happens, the teams would do so on their own accord, not by some act of judgement by the federations. Then again, the teams are all majority-owned by MLS, so I'll put the chances of them ever moving to CPL at a fraction above 0%.

Also, in a scenario where the CPL is crazy successful (which we should all want), it stands to reason that MLS would also have forged ahead of where it is now. The three Canadian clubs are already worth nine-digit sums in the current iteration of MLS, so if the league continues to grow there will be even bigger financial incentive for those clubs to stay. Unfortunately the U.S. market is 10x bigger than ours, making the pot that much sweeter.

To reiterate, it would cost a ton of money to get the Big 3 to move to CPL willingly. If the federations foolishly pull their sanctioning, I suspect MLSE/Saputo/Kerfoot lawyers would cost the federations a lot more.

Edited September 27, 2018 by RS

[Ansem]

51 minutes ago, RS said:

I'm only responding to this part as I don't have all day to do a line-by-line rebut on a rant, but you initially implied that either the USSF or the CSA could/would force the three MLS teams to move out of MLS (which, by letter of the law, they can but it's not realistic at all) , then when I said that neither will do so you'd shifted the narrative to whether it will happen if the CPL is successful enough to justify the teams moving.

My point is they can. Fact

My other point is that FIFA doesn't support teams playing in other country's league except under strict circumstances. Fact

Will they? Emphasis on long term and if CPL grows to the point where it makes business sense as I put in bold in past posts from the get go. 

51 minutes ago, RS said:

If that happens, the teams would do so on their own accord, not by some act of judgement by the federations. Then again, the teams are all majority-owned by MLS, so I'll put the chances of them ever moving to CPL at a fraction above 0%.

Inaccurate.

The 3 teams requires the CSA sanction to play in MLS, which wouldn't let unsanctioned clubs compete. Fact

Well aware of "single entity" but it's laughable that an "out" clause doesn't exist. That's business 101. People seem to forget that the teams also owns shares in MLS which ALSO appreciated quite substantially since joining. 

Chance of moving to CPL, again, Emphasis on long term and if CPL grows to the point where it makes business sense 

51 minutes ago, RS said:

Also, in a scenario where the CPL is crazy successful (which we should all want), it stands to reason that MLS would also have forged ahead of where it is now. The three Canadian clubs are already worth nine-digit sums in the current iteration of MLS, so if the league continues to grow there will be even bigger financial incentive for those clubs to stay. Unfortunately the U.S. market is 10x bigger than ours, making the pot that much sweeter.

I had posted the interview Lenarduzzi gave to Sportsnet. MLS will go 3.0 but I seriously doubt that Vancouver and Montreal will keep up. I think only TFC can go 3.0 to compete with the other giants. Go listen to that interview because that's Lenarduzzi himself defending the way Vancouver plans to do business which is infuriating some fans and which the interviewer is correctly pointing out that they could become the MLS minnow at this rate. He points out Columbus and Kansas City as examples. Sure, in MLS 2.0, you could win the cup with modest expenses but no way you can in MLS 3.0 unless you pull a "Leicester City miracle". Good luck selling that to fans who are already seeing the writing on the wall. 

As for Montreal, Bologna is Saputo's baby and they are in relegation zone. Their TV ratings are atrocious, their marketing equally bad, stadium is poorly located and Garber himself calls out the team on attendance. Jeremy Filosa, a Quebec sport reporter, said himself that there are so many richer markets wanting to get into MLS that Montreal better gets its act together to avoid another Columbus situation. Montreal having mediocre season doesn't help, that won't do in MLS 3.0...especially when the MLB comes back.

Proof 

Don't forget that those 2 teams paid $40M to get in and in terms of TV markets, they are small fries compared to the other markets lining up to get in...willing and able to build world class SSS and break the bank to get in. In what world do you think that they care more about Vancouver and Montreal over Columbus, a US city? Wow, and I'm the unrealistic one. 

Perhaps the true picture is somewhere in between. TFC can keep up and Toronto is the ultimate Canadian prize for MLS. Garber already shown that he cares little for Montreal, let alone Vancouver. 

So we'll see...

Edited September 27, 2018 by Ansem

[LAK]

Valuations are the biggest factor in this scenario though. Montreal in the MLS is valued at $175 Million and Vancouver at $150 million. They are both near the bottom of the MLS in terms of valuations, but I don't think CPL teams are catching them in value in the next 10 - 20 years.