Marcelo Flores

[Kadenge]

Marcelo should listen to Borjan's post game interview. With a Canadian flag draped around his shoulders, Milan was 13 when his family emigrated to Canada, and in his words Canada gave them everything and this is his way of giving back. Wouldn't it be nice if some of our young Canadians who were born and raised here felt the same way.  Borjan  legend ❤

 

 

[dyslexic nam]

53 minutes ago, AvroArrow said:

If he only switches after we qualify, then I don't want him on the WC roster.  He played no role in getting us there.

Principles aside, I just don’t think he would warrant a spot.  He may have oodles of potential but is he’s really going to displace guys like Oso or Hoilett by next November?  Doubt it.  That is why I keep making a distinction between someone like Jebbison and Flores.  I think the former could make a contribution now and compete for a spot, whereas Flores is one for the 2026 cycle.  There is a reason why neither Canada nor Mexico have included him in their squads for the current campaign.   

[youllneverwalkalone]

I guess it depends on his skillset. We saw yesterday how thin we are in central midfield. If Flores is more like Osorio and can play farther back, we absolutely need him now. Like as soon as Wednesday.

[dyslexic nam]

1 minute ago, youllneverwalkalone said:

I guess it depends on his skillset. We saw yesterday how thin we are in central midfield. If Flores is more like Osorio and can play farther back, we absolutely need him now. Like as soon as Wednesday.

To each his own I guess, but I just can’t see it. In central mid we have a number of guys who can play in an advanced role - Oso, Hoilett, Kaye, Hutch, Fraser and probably others I am missing.  It would be nice to see Flores in a camp but I doubt he displaces any of those guys by November.  

[youllneverwalkalone]

Injuries, cards, covid, leaves you with no CMs on the bench pretty quick. It happened yesterday when we were being overrun in midfield. I imagine (truly cause ai have no fucking idea) that a guy like Flores could come in a help with the possession battle.

[TGAA_Star]

10 minutes ago, youllneverwalkalone said:

I guess it depends on his skillset. We saw yesterday how thin we are in central midfield. If Flores is more like Osorio and can play farther back, we absolutely need him now. Like as soon as Wednesday.

Which is why if we qualify, I can see the CSA making contact for that nationality switch

[king1010]

27 minutes ago, TGAA_Star said:

Which is why if we qualify, I can see the CSA making contact for that nationality switch

you think they already haven't done that? 

[finchster]

2 hours ago, AvroArrow said:

If he only switches after we qualify, then I don't want him on the WC roster.  He played no role in getting us there.

Yes, let's be petty. That will get the program far...

[AvroArrow]

19 minutes ago, finchster said:

Yes, let's be petty. That will get the program far...

It has nothing to do with pettiness and has everything to do with building a cohesive team.  Herdman has preached buiding a "brotherhood".  Who are you going to cut to bring in Flores?  What does that do to the team structure?  How can you preach camaraderie and loyalty to the team if you start parachuting in people that couldn't be bothered to commit when the process first started?

Yes, we have good players but we also have a team that has bought in.  This is not something that is easy to create and would not be easy to rebuild.

You dance with the one that brought you.

[dyslexic nam]

I just hope Flores doesn’t base his decision on the star rating of this thread.   1.5/5

Ouch

[rdb9ty]

32 minutes ago, finchster said:

Yes, let's be petty. That will get the program far...

He's an 18 year old kid that has yet to feature for Arsenal (my team) in any capacity like in a carabao cup or europa league match and we are dire in midfield. I think that speaks to how unprepared he is to play at a high level at this current stage in his career. He may well become a great player for Canada or Mexico, but this isn't an Alphonso Davies situation where he was a generational talent.

Like someone said above, Flores is probably more for 2026 than the current cycle. And IMO, he isn't deserving to take a spot of a guy like Piette or Kaye or whoever else on the final world cup roster because he didn't help the team get there. Is that petty? Maybe but all of these guys are about "brotherhood". If we qualify, we already will have some tough decisions to make on who to leave at home. 

[JAVIERF]

He is an attacking midfielder?  I haven't seen him I know Gerry put him for 10 minutes in Mexico the other friendly

[JAVIERF]

5 minutes ago, rdb9ty said:

He's an 18 year old kid that has yet to feature for Arsenal (my team) in any capacity like in a carabao cup or europa league match and we are dire in midfield. I think that speaks to how unprepared he is to play at a high level at this current stage in his career. He may well become a great player for Canada or Mexico, but this isn't an Alphonso Davies situation where he was a generational talent.

Like someone said above, Flores is probably more for 2026 than the current cycle. And IMO, he isn't deserving to take a spot of a guy like Piette or Kaye or whoever else on the final world cup roster because he didn't help the team get there. Is that petty? Maybe but all of these guys are about "brotherhood". If we qualify, we already will have some tough decisions to make on who to leave at home. 

The all whites in 2010, brought Winston Reid and another fellow to the team because they were an upgrade, this is professional football even though international football is as Valdano says the most amateur side of football, the love for a country

[canuckgbp]

5 minutes ago, JAVIERF said:

He is an attacking midfielder?  I haven't seen him I know Gerry put him for 10 minutes in Mexico the other friendly

Think mainly he is a #10 attacking midfielder. I assume he can play out wide but not sure on his speed. 

[Kadenge]

1 hour ago, youllneverwalkalone said:

I guess it depends on his skillset. We saw yesterday how thin we are in central midfield. If Flores is more like Osorio and can play farther back, we absolutely need him now. Like as soon as Wednesday.

Flores is super talented, but he has not played a single pro min. Now if he gets mins with Arsenal or out on loan and impresses that's a different story. Plus we are short #8s and #6s. Flores is an attacking mid by all accounts. He does not have the physicality at this point to play as a #8. 

[canuckgbp]

Injuries happen. Players may lose their regular place with their respective clubs. 

I think for some players on the fence, Herdman may say Nationals League is a good spot to commit and get introduced into the camp. No guarantees to be on a WCQ roster tho. But if they aren't committed to Nations League, don't think some friendlies in the fall would be enough.

We still have a summer window for these young duals as well. Maybe they upgrade the level they are playing at and then try and make their case. 

Still think we need to keep the future in mind and keep things practical. 

[JAVIERF]

7 minutes ago, canuckgbp said:

Think mainly he is a #10 attacking midfielder. I assume he can play out wide but not sure on his speed. 

To play wide you either are really fast or a great dribbler like David Ginola or others, 

Or both Ryan Giggs/ Robben

[Snowcrash]

54 minutes ago, AvroArrow said:

It has nothing to do with pettiness and has everything to do with building a cohesive team.  Herdman has preached buiding a "brotherhood".  Who are you going to cut to bring in Flores?  What does that do to the team structure?  How can you preach camaraderie and loyalty to the team if you start parachuting in people that couldn't be bothered to commit when the process first started?

Yes, we have good players but we also have a team that has bought in.  This is not something that is easy to create and would not be easy to rebuild.

You dance with the one that brought you.

I'm sure Herdman will run this by the senior players and if Borjan is ok with it, the invite goes out.  

[Bison44]

7 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

But that's the question Corbeanu doesn't seem to want to reply to this call-up, which is why I'm harping on it. Not understanding where and when. 

Corbeanu is cap tied (right?), he is committed to us, excited about playing for Canada, seemingly talking up other duals in europe, not humming and hawing about going to another nation, no coy instagram posts or waiting until he is 23 and then deciding.  Plus half the board didnt think he would get called anyways and might not get any minutes.  

There has to be some give and take with the camps and Herdman/players without it being an automatic black mark.  I'm fine with that.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

42 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Corbeanu is cap tied (right?), he is committed to us, excited about playing for Canada, seemingly talking up other duals in europe, not humming and hawing about going to another nation, no coy instagram posts or waiting until he is 23 and then deciding.  Plus half the board didnt think he would get called anyways and might not get any minutes.  

There has to be some give and take with the camps and Herdman/players without it being an automatic black mark.  I'm fine with that.  

I'm mostly just shit disturbing with Theo, but the fact is: you can't turn down a national team call-up at this time, in these circumstances. 

I think it will make it harder for him in the future. Herdman could easily leave him out next window, since in the end we have plenty of wing attack options and will have Davies back. 

[finchster]

2 hours ago, AvroArrow said:

It has nothing to do with pettiness and has everything to do with building a cohesive team.  Herdman has preached buiding a "brotherhood".  Who are you going to cut to bring in Flores?  What does that do to the team structure?  How can you preach camaraderie and loyalty to the team if you start parachuting in people that couldn't be bothered to commit when the process first started?

Yes, we have good players but we also have a team that has bought in.  This is not something that is easy to create and would not be easy to rebuild.

You dance with the one that brought you.

A brotherhood of winners is easy to create. if Heardman thinks someone else can help them win, he will do it.

 

2 hours ago, rdb9ty said:

He's an 18 year old kid that has yet to feature for Arsenal (my team) in any capacity like in a carabao cup or europa league match and we are dire in midfield. I think that speaks to how unprepared he is to play at a high level at this current stage in his career. He may well become a great player for Canada or Mexico, but this isn't an Alphonso Davies situation where he was a generational talent.

Like someone said above, Flores is probably more for 2026 than the current cycle. And IMO, he isn't deserving to take a spot of a guy like Piette or Kaye or whoever else on the final world cup roster because he didn't help the team get there. Is that petty? Maybe but all of these guys are about "brotherhood". If we qualify, we already will have some tough decisions to make on who to leave at home. 

This is a different argument, one I agree with. Flores isn't good enough right now to help our national team, he is a prospect. However, I disagree with the principal of not calling someone because they were not there. Winning is the goal here. If Daniel Jebbison wanted to play for Canada, it would be pretty easy to cut Cavallini. 

[Floortom]

5 minutes ago, finchster said:

 

 

This is a different argument, one I agree with. Flores isn't good enough right now to help our national team, he is a prospect. However, I disagree with the principal of not calling someone because they were not there. Winning is the goal here. If Daniel Jebbison wanted to play for Canada, it would be pretty easy to cut Cavallini. 

It's a problem every team has I guess, but man I'll actually feel sorry for some of the vets who have been here through all the crap that dont get called into the actual World Cup squad. Not specific to Cava necessarily but will be tough to see

[Unnamed Trialist]

16 minutes ago, finchster said:

A brotherhood of winners is easy to create. if Heardman thinks someone else can help them win, he will do it.

 

This is a different argument, one I agree with. Flores isn't good enough right now to help our national team, he is a prospect. However, I disagree with the principal of not calling someone because they were not there. Winning is the goal here. If Daniel Jebbison wanted to play for Canada, it would be pretty easy to cut Cavallini. 

We are not going to cut Cavallini or anyone else for some kids like Jebbison or Corbeanu playing in League One. It is a low level, fine for a younger player to develop, but tactically Neanderthal. It'd be an insult. 

The exception of course would be a third keeper, knowning he'd never play.

Remember that League One contains the 45th to 69th best teams in England. What does playing well at that level really prove? 

Now of course if a player is in Championship, that is quite different.

Theo, Jebbison, Flores, even Lucas Dias (who I think is very promising) they are just projects still. They could be very close to making a shift, but it is what it is.

Edited January 31, 2022 by Unnamed Trialist

[dyslexic nam]

12 minutes ago, Floortom said:

It's a problem every team has I guess, but man I'll actually feel sorry for some of the vets who have been here through all the crap that dont get called into the actual World Cup squad. Not specific to Cava necessarily but will be tough to see

The reality is that it would have to be a very specific set of circumstances for that to happen.  

- Hutch isn’t going anyway barring some catastrophic drop off in form.  Even if he came back to MLS for a victory lap or two he would still be going to Qatar. 

- Vitoria is the oldest defender by a decent margin and he will be in Qatar - probably starting our first group stage game.   He is an anchor and the thing he isn’t great at (pace) isn’t likely to change by November.  He is a tall, cerebral defender who exploits both of those attributes well.  

- most of our backs/wingers aren’t in danger of being dropped.  There are guys right on the cusp fighting for inclusion like Theo.   A guy like Liam is likely to be in the overall squad but will have to fight like hell for playing time.  

- In mid we will see guys like Kaye (can be a bit inconsistent) and Hoilett (getting older) unless something pretty drastic happens over the next few months.  A call from Flores wouldn’t change that IMO.

- At forward, Larin and David are obvious locks.  Ike may need to keep justifying his inclusion - especially if a guy like Jebbison decides he would climb aboard the hype train.  The same might be said of Cav if he has a rough season in MLS (or wherever) but I still think the default is to include him for the strengths he brings.  

Bottom line is that I doubt any vets get dropped unless their own play dictates it.   I still think that by next November, Jebbison will be the only potential inclusion that could give Herdman a headache.  

[finchster]

Just now, Unnamed Trialist said:

We are not going to cut Cavallini or anyone else for some kids like Jebbison or Corbeanu playing in League One. It is a low level, fine for a younger player to develop, but tactically Neanderthal. It'd be an insult. 

The exception of course would be a third keeper, knowning he'd never play.

Remember that League One contains the 45th to 69th best teams in England. What does playing well at that level really prove? 

Now of course if a player is in Championship, that is quite different.

Theo, Jebbison, they are just projects still. They could be very close to making a shift, but it is what it is.

What level on that pyramid would you rank the Whitecaps? 

At the very least, you would have to take a look at Jebbison vs Cavallini, especially after Cavallini's form this year. I don't want to derail the thread, so let's leave it there.