Cyle Larin

[red card]

3 hours ago, TOcanadafan said:

The reality is that billionaire owners want guaranteed returns on their investments.  I agree from a fan point of view pro/rel can be exciting.  If anything, it won’t be long until the top leagues in Europe become ‘closed’ or another attempt at a super league is made…unfortunate reality now that sport is big business.

This is a basic or one size fits all view.

Up until the 1990s, investments in North American pro sports were thought to be a money losing proposition. There is an adage: “‘How do you become a millionaire? Start out as a billionaire and buy a sports team.’” Today, it's still not making a return YoY. 

In club football, especially within a pro/rel pyramid, there are so many different risk tolerance points and different price points. It really is a bit of a choose your own adventure as an owner.

So, you don't need to be a billionaire to won most of the world's 4,500 pro clubs including in the NWSL and CPL. Plus, ownership models have diversified into multi-ownership, minority stakes, fractional stakes, sovereign states, athletes/celebrities & private equity.

The motivations behind owning a football club today varies from asset appreciation, real estate play, vanity play, content play, access to global markets, improving your global reputation, passion for football, support/connect with community & establish a legacy.

If you want scarcity value, then you're preference is for a club in a closed league or one of the 15 mega clubs. If you want to maximize your potential opportunity, you're preference would be to own the Wrexham's of club football.

[Kadenge]

Hopefully Valladolid stay up and improve their squad. Larin's in a groove, seems very comfortable with his teammates and has settled in La Liga after 1/2 season, scoring vs some of the top/mid teams. He needs stability/continuity after playing in 3 leagues over a short period.  Besides, I like having a Cdn in La Liga. Now to get David in EPL and Tajon in Serie A.

Edited May 25, 2023 by Kadenge

[Unnamed Trialist]

Turns out today the articles are out about more teams interested in signing him. 

In fact, this one says Osasuna has already been in contact with Bruges to get him on loan for next season, in similar terms to what he has at RV. 

https://www.elgoldigital.com/futbol/real-valladolid/cyle-larin-mete-al-valladolid-en-problemas-tras-exhibirse-contra-el-fc-barcelona/

Mind you, another article I saw in Goal from today said they were interested in Iheanacho at Leicester, and that they would keep their Croatian striker who was at the WC, Budimir. Osasuna are a slight step up from RV.

And this one says that if RV go down, after having negotiated apparently with Cádiz in January, they may be interested if they stay up. Cádiz imo is not enough of a jump in quality up for it to be interesting for Cyle.

https://todofichajes.com/larin-entre-valladolid-y-cadiz/

Back in March word in the press was that various EPL clubs were interested, thinking of the summer transfer window, and that the value was from 13-18 million euros. Haven't seen these articles that much recently.

https://www.elgoldigital.com/futbol/real-valladolid/el-chollo-del-valladolid-con-cyle-larin-ronaldo-tiene-un-plan-multimillonario/

Other articles appearing lately confirm that Valladolid has an option of 1.5 million to buy him if they stay up, and that they would build next year's team around him, not sell. Basically because at that price, you are getting him for a steal. Others say that Ronaldo Nazario de Lima wants to exercise the option then sell at a big profit to Premiership. 

In La Liga, certain teams are clearly questioning their main strikers. Betis seems to not be happy with Borja Iglesias (Betis is a marvellous team). Valencia has not done well with Cavani, not surprisingly. Real Sociedad has Sorloth on loan from Leipzig with no option to buy. In the end after losing Isak and others they have had a great season and are sniffing a Champions League spot. But the player isn't theirs. Betis, Real Sociedad, both great options as I see it.

Edited May 25, 2023 by Unnamed Trialist

[InglewoodJack]

There’s a parallel universe out there where there’s a Spanish counterpart to this forum and everyone is combing through Fifa nationality rules to see if Larin can switch over to their national team

[frmr]

It's insane how polarizing Larin is. When he first went to Besiktas they were saying they couldn't believe he was a professional footballer, then on his return he becomes one of the most dangerous strikers in the league, then in Bruges they absolutely hated him and wanted him gone, now RV fans are essentially treating him like the messiah. It's crazy how much of a rollercoaster his career has been. Even with Canada he has had some high peaks and low valleys.

[The Beaver 2.0]

40 minutes ago, frmr said:

It's insane how polarizing Larin is. When he first went to Besiktas they were saying they couldn't believe he was a professional footballer, then on his return he becomes one of the most dangerous strikers in the league, then in Bruges they absolutely hated him and wanted him gone, now RV fans are essentially treating him like the messiah. It's crazy how much of a rollercoaster his career has been. Even with Canada he has had some high peaks and low valleys.

Some of this must come down to an inherent bias against footballers from Canada, but clearly Cyle is putting in the work and becoming a better footballer. Maybe he's drunk the kookade that Herdman's been shilling, and he's taken things up a notch. The lad certainly seems motivated.

[Obinna]

From the star article:

“Since I got to Valladolid, everyone’s been welcoming, and I settled in nicely,” he told MLSSoccer last week. “I knew if I could get minutes and play, I would score goals. They know where I want the ball and how I want the ball.”

This is what I was talking about earlier this morning, a few posts ago. Larin is having success because he has a club willing to play to his strengths. They needed a goal scorer badly and when they got one they tailored their play to him. Giving the ball to him in the spaces he wants, knowing that doing so will get them goals (and hopefully get them out of the relegation zone). 

Larin and RV are almost there. They need to stay up and he needs to stay there in my opinion. And if he is going to move it needs to be a similar situation where the team is committed to making him central to their play. 

[canadasoccer20]

2 hours ago, Kadenge said:

Hopefully Valladolid stay up and improve their squad. Larin's in a groove, seems very comfortable with his teammates and has settled in La Liga after 1/2 season, scoring vs some of the top/mid teams. He needs stability/continuity after playing in 3 leagues over a short period.  Besides, I like having a Cdn in La Liga. Now to get David in EPL and Tajon in Serie A.

Having 4 players in the top 4 leagues would be so sweet. I still remember not that long ago, it was cool just seeing Simeon Jackson play in the EPL for low table Norwich City and thinking that was awesome. 

[TGAA_Star]

If Valladolid manage to stay up and don't get relegated then yes I would love for Larin to stay but if they get relegated then no sorry Cyle must leave

[Obinna]

7 minutes ago, TGAA_Star said:

If Valladolid manage to stay up and don't get relegated then yes I would love for Larin to stay but if they get relegated then no sorry Cyle must leave

I think that's fair and I somewhat (mostly?) agree. I wonder though how bad it would be to play in La Liga 2?

Here's my thinking:

We support, if not applaud, our players who make their bones in the English Championship. We have players in the 2.Bundesliga and we deem it acceptable. Is Larin playing in La Liga 2 really that bad?

I understand that La Liga 2 is not as highly regarded, but it's probably better than Serie B or Ligue 2, so it's no worse than the 3rd best 2nd division in the world, right? And Larin would feast and continue to bang goals in, which is what we want, right? So if they get relegated and he stays and he is scoring for them and the national team and they go straight back up, it's probably not a bad situation, I am thinking. Not my preference, obviously, but we need this guy scoring.

Moving to Osasuna or similar comes with no guarentee he replicates this, but we know things are working at RV...

This is probably hypothetical though because I don't think he considers La Liga 2, but I just wonder.......

[InglewoodJack]

Valencia lost today which doesn’t directly impact RV, but now there is a two point differential between RV in 18th and Valencia in 13th. Vibe check looks like Valladolid have one of the easier schedules between now and the end of the season. 
 

1 minute ago, Obinna said:

I think that's fair and I somewhat (mostly?) agree. I wonder though how bad it would be to play in La Liga 2?

Here's my thinking:

We support, if not applaud, our players who make their bones in the English Championship. We have players in the 2.Bundesliga and we deem it acceptable. Is Larin playing in La Liga 2 really that bad?

I understand that La Liga 2 is not as highly regarded, but it's probably better than Serie B or Ligue 2, so it's no worse than the 3rd best 2nd division in the world, right? And Larin would feast and continue to bang goals in, which is what we want, right? So if they get relegated and he stays and he is scoring for them and the national team and they go straight back up, it's probably not a bad situation, I am thinking. Not my preference, obviously, but we need this guy scoring.

Moving to Osasuna or similar comes with no guarentee he replicates this, but we know things are working at RV...

This is probably hypothetical though because I don't think he considers La Liga 2, but I just wonder.......

If he was much younger, I might agree, but he’s proven that he can do it in LaLiga. We’ve seen so many players get contracts they don’t deserve, fall drastically short of expectations after a big move that worst case scenario that Larin doesn’t repeat this season next, he still has earned a chance to play in a top 5 league. Short of a Wrexham situation where they can attract guys to drop down a division to be part of a massive project, I would find it hard to believe that there isn’t any top league interest in arguably the best winter transfer in the top 5 leagues. 

[Obinna]

1 minute ago, InglewoodJack said:

Valencia lost today which doesn’t directly impact RV, but now there is a two point differential between RV in 18th and Valencia in 13th. Vibe check looks like Valladolid have one of the easier schedules between now and the end of the season. 
 

If he was much younger, I might agree, but he’s proven that he can do it in LaLiga. We’ve seen so many players get contracts they don’t deserve, fall drastically short of expectations after a big move that worst case scenario that Larin doesn’t repeat this season next, he still has earned a chance to play in a top 5 league. Short of a Wrexham situation where they can attract guys to drop down a division to be part of a massive project, I would find it hard to believe that there isn’t any top league interest in arguably the best winter transfer in the top 5 leagues. 

Yeah good points. If you're Larin you just got a taste of a top 5 league, you're going to want more, because you are 28 and don't have much time left in your prime, plus you've been chasing this level your whole career. I can definitely see why he wouldn't want to drop down, nor do I think he will if it comes to that. I was just thinking that maybe it wouldn't be so bad for him and the national team. Good level? check. Team who values him and can (and should) go back up? check.

It'd also be risky perhaps, because playing down could hurt his reputation and value, even if he scores tons of goals, plus they could get stuck down there. If he were younger (to your point) he could sacrafice the lost year, but he doesn't really have the time to "waste".

[InglewoodJack]

8 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Yeah good points. If you're Larin you just got a taste of a top 5 league, you're going to want more, because you are 28 and don't have much time left in your prime, plus you've been chasing this level your whole career. I can definitely see why he wouldn't want to drop down, nor do I think he will if it comes to that. I was just thinking that maybe it wouldn't be so bad for him and the national team. Good level? check. Team who values him and can (and should) go back up? check.

It'd also be risky perhaps, because playing down could hurt his reputation and value, even if he scores tons of goals, plus they could get stuck down there. If he were younger (to your point) he could sacrafice the lost year, but he doesn't really have the time to "waste".

I think for him it's mainly a question of salary- I think one big reason that it took a while to get another team after Besiktas is that he had some pretty big financial demands. Beyond that though, I think he saw that after a good season at Besiktas, he had all this interest from good teams, and after a poor season, he ends up at Brugge which is probably a ~lateral move or slight step up I guess since he did have a chance to play Champions League before they brought in other guys, so who knows what happens if he plays in LaLiga2- he might not get this chance again.

Either way though, I would be shocked if there's absolutely no interest in La Liga after this season, and if there somehow isn't, I think it would be hard for Club Brugge not to accept a few million for a permanent transfer for him, especially after they poured 16M into Yaremchuk who was mostly a dud, I think. Or maybe Brugge takes him back because Jutgla doesn't look like he's gonna be their guy, but I doubt it.

[Bison44]

2 hours ago, frmr said:

It's insane how polarizing Larin is. When he first went to Besiktas they were saying they couldn't believe he was a professional footballer, then on his return he becomes one of the most dangerous strikers in the league, then in Bruges they absolutely hated him and wanted him gone, now RV fans are essentially treating him like the messiah. It's crazy how much of a rollercoaster his career has been. Even with Canada he has had some high peaks and low valleys.

It proves that prob 70% of people shooting their mouths off on the internet are idiots.  Look at our own board.....look at me!!!   I thought MDS was the answer in VAN, that Bradley would do well in TFC and after seeing Sirois in WPG he would be with the Impact in a year or two and getting into the CMNT conversation....ummm wait I was right about that one.  

[InglewoodJack]

Except me. I am always right and always measured

[Obinna]

3 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

I think for him it's mainly a question of salary- I think one big reason that it took a while to get another team after Besiktas is that he had some pretty big financial demands. Beyond that though, I think he saw that after a good season at Besiktas, he had all this interest from good teams, and after a poor season, he ends up at Brugge which is probably a ~lateral move or slight step up I guess since he did have a chance to play Champions League before they brought in other guys, so who knows what happens if he plays in LaLiga2- he might not get this chance again.

Either way though, I would be shocked if there's absolutely no interest in La Liga after this season, and if there somehow isn't, I think it would be hard for Club Brugge not to accept a few million for a permanent transfer for him, especially after they poured 16M into Yaremchuk who was mostly a dud, I think. Or maybe Brugge takes him back because Jutgla doesn't look like he's gonna be their guy, but I doubt it.

Me too. I don't doubt for a second they'll be interest, but the club and situation needs to be right for him to succeed. That's the main thing for me. It's all well and good for a team like Valencia to come calling, but if they aren't going to make him the focal put of their patterns of play (they won't in all likelyhood), then Larin won't do well - and I am pretty convinced of that. We have enough evidence of that by now. He's not the kind of player who can thrive despite the system. The system needs to work for him. 

Yeah Salary is important for sure, but his criteria before Brugge was Champions League or Top 5 league - and he took the former. The problem was that Brugge didn't need him, they just took advantage of the situation and stole him from someone else he was close to joining (can't recall if that was Olympicos or someone else). Larin was almost a bonus signing for them, so it was easy to sit him after a few games and subsequently loan him out. Club Brugge look pretty dumb for it, but it was really no skin off their back at the time. 

[frmr]

7 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

Except me. I am always right and always measured

I generally do agree with most of your posts to be fair. My completely unbiased opinion of myself is that I too am a voice of reason. Unless I'm drunk, then I wake up to intense shame and embarrassment over the shite I posted the night before.

[Bison44]

Just now, frmr said:

I generally do agree with most of your posts to be fair. My completely unbiased opinion of myself is that I too am a voice of reason. Unless I'm drunk, then I wake up to intense shame and embarrassment over the shite I posted the night before.

Have you met El Hombre??  You have nothing to be ashamed off.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

51 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I think that's fair and I somewhat (mostly?) agree. I wonder though how bad it would be to play in La Liga 2?

Here's my thinking:

We support, if not applaud, our players who make their bones in the English Championship. We have players in the 2.Bundesliga and we deem it acceptable. Is Larin playing in La Liga 2 really that bad?

I understand that La Liga 2 is not as highly regarded, but it's probably better than Serie B or Ligue 2, so it's no worse than the 3rd best 2nd division in the world, right? And Larin would feast and continue to bang goals in, which is what we want, right? So if they get relegated and he stays and he is scoring for them and the national team and they go straight back up, it's probably not a bad situation, I am thinking. Not my preference, obviously, but we need this guy scoring.

Moving to Osasuna or similar comes with no guarentee he replicates this, but we know things are working at RV...

This is probably hypothetical though because I don't think he considers La Liga 2, but I just wonder.......

2nd division just isn't anywhere near as interesting, obviously, and probably at team like Valladolid would offload him anyways even if he were on contract.

I would not like it and fortunately it is not going to happen regardless.

If you are in 2nd in a powerhouse, same in England I'd say, then fine, you are building for what you feel is a sure promotion the next year or two. But Spanish 2nd is very tight and plenty of strong teams, historically important clubs with big stadiums and fan bases (as with Championship indeed), just can't make their way back up. Take Zaragoza, Oviedo, Sporting Gijon, the teams from the Canary Islands. Málaga just dropped to third division. Valladolid in 2nd is probably around 6-8th in terms of potential (same could be said of Almería, even Cádiz and Girona, all would not be favoured to re-promote).

[Obinna]

8 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

2nd division just isn't anywhere near as interesting, obviously, and probably at team like Valladolid would offload him anyways even if he were on contract.

I would not like it and fortunately it is not going to happen regardless.

If you are in 2nd in a powerhouse, same in England I'd say, then fine, you are building for what you feel is a sure promotion the next year or two. But Spanish 2nd is very tight and plenty of strong teams, historically important clubs with big stadiums and fan bases (as with Championship indeed), just can't make their way back up. Take Zaragoza, Oviedo, Sporting Gijon, the teams from the Canary Islands. Málaga just dropped to third division. Valladolid in 2nd is probably around 6-8th in terms of potential (same could be said of Almería, even Cádiz and Girona, all would not be favoured to re-promote).

That's crazy, but that's for that. I think it's true now that you mention. And crazy that Malaga is in 3rd now. We see that in England though. Look at Sunderland going down to League One and only just now they are finally pushing promotion.

[footballfreak]

8 hours ago, Kadenge said:

Promotion & relegation makes leagues more competitive.

I don’t want to make this a whole back and forth, but I fundamentally disagree with this narrative. Relegation battles make things more competitive for a handful of teams at the bottom, but only do so at the cost of making the mid-table utterly pointless. Even in England, with its 85 European qualifying places, there is a morass of teams that effectively have nothing to play for besides a few bonus millions. You could not pay me to watch 10th vs 13th.
 

Watching the Whitecaps battle for a playoff spot before ultimately falling short on the last day may not have always been great football, but it was certainly compelling. Was it do-or-die stuff where the entire future of the club was on the line? No, but honestly I wouldn’t want it to be. I don’t think an entire community institution should ever be at the whims of a few bad football games. 

TLDR It doesn’t matter where you draw the “good stuff/bad stuff” line. There will always be teams at the end of the season with nothing to play for.

 

1 hour ago, frmr said:

It's insane how polarizing Larin is. When he first went to Besiktas they were saying they couldn't believe he was a professional footballer, then on his return he becomes one of the most dangerous strikers in the league, then in Bruges they absolutely hated him and wanted him gone, now RV fans are essentially treating him like the messiah. It's crazy how much of a rollercoaster his career has been. Even with Canada he has had some high peaks and low valleys.

Even before Besiktas, he had that whole saga with Orlando - his rise to prominence, then the DUI, and finally becoming a minor pariah in MLS because of the way he forced his transfer.

[InglewoodJack]

41 minutes ago, frmr said:

I generally do agree with most of your posts to be fair. My completely unbiased opinion of myself is that I too am a voice of reason. Unless I'm drunk, then I wake up to intense shame and embarrassment over the shite I posted the night before.

I’m mostly talking shit. I’ve definitely been wrong on a bunch of stuff, and will likely continue to do so. I bring a certain ignorant fiery passion to Canadian soccer that we lack compared to other top soccer nations

[Mattd97]

16 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

Short of a Wrexham situation where they can attract guys to drop down a division to be part of a massive project, I would find it hard to believe that there isn’t any top league interest in arguably the best winter transfer in the top 5 leagues. 

I agree, RR should bring Cyle in for the Paul Mullin bump

[InglewoodJack]

3 minutes ago, Mattd97 said:

I agree, RR should bring Cyle in for the Paul Mullin bump

By the time they reach the championship (2, 3 years if they stumble, obviously), Larin will be at that level and should definitely do this

[Unnamed Trialist]

Rumours today that Ronaldo is thinking about selling Real Valladolid, if they stay in top flight. 

https://diariodevalladolid.elmundo.es/articulo/deportes/ronaldo-plantea-venta-real-valladolid/20230526225932463350.html

He paid 35 million and would be asking 125 million, as reported in the Brazilian press, so he can concentrate on Cruzeiro and live in the city where they play, Belo Horizonte. Unusual to have destabilizing news about a team when they are playing to avoid relegation, don't know who this benefits.

The team plays Almería away at 7pm local time, with all players healthy except El Yamiq the Morrocan international defender.