Liam Millar

[Cheeta]

8 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Honestly if that's the system the team is playing...

Shrug.  And that's life isn't it?  

If the man thinks Future Liam, looking back on his career would be OK with the height of that career being at Preston North End, not playing at his best position, then great.  If he thinks Future Liam would feel, underwhelmed, then not so great.

(That said, and to prove I'm neither encouraging or discouraging anything, it seems to me Uncle 'tiba spent half his career playing out of his best position and he went on to become legend). 

Good luck!   

[jhoops__]

He did look so sharp on the wing at Preston.   Most supporters want him there as well.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

37 minutes ago, Cheeta said:

Shrug.  And that's life isn't it?  

If the man thinks Future Liam, looking back on his career would be OK with the height of that career being at Preston North End, not playing at his best position, then great.  If he thinks Future Liam would feel, underwhelmed, then not so great.

(That said, and to prove I'm neither encouraging or discouraging anything, it seems to me Uncle 'tiba spent half his career playing out of his best position and he went on to become legend). 

Good luck!   

Yeah.

Essentially what I was saying. The manager has run three at the back with not a lot of winger play for 5-6 years at 3 clubs. Probably not changing. Do you like the club and the area (it's close to family etc.) enough to play "out of position", where you have had some success or do you think there are better opportunities to kick on elsewhere? 

 

Big decision. 

 

All that said, not a massive fan of chairman airing something like that. But we are very biased.  

[InglewoodJack]

24 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

All that said, not a massive fan of chairman airing something like that. But we are very biased.  

I think they’ve already come out and more or less said that they may have difficulty paying his transfer fee, so this is a good way to let the fans off easy ie “great player but we can’t spend €1M on a guy who doesn’t fit in our system”

[PegCityCam]

1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said:

I think they’ve already come out and more or less said that they may have difficulty paying his transfer fee, so this is a good way to let the fans off easy ie “great player but we can’t spend €1M on a guy who doesn’t fit in our system”

If he balls out (and we know he will🤞) at the Copa then for sure they can't. I say onwards and upwards for Liam!

[Shway]

3 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

Hey man, great season on loan, we really wanna keep you… hey real quick, you know that position you played at Basel where you had a lot of trouble and ended up getting benched? Anyways, we want you to play that position instead next seasons thanks!

Believe it or not, he was playing a whole lot of wingback at Basel... just in on the other side.

[InglewoodJack]

48 minutes ago, Shway said:

Believe it or not, he was playing a whole lot of wingback at Basel... just in on the other side.

Yeah, that’s what I meant- I think the season he went and scored all those goals he was a winger, then became a WB and had a really tough season, then Preston played him as a winger and he looked awesome. Forgot he was on the right.

Just sounds like they’re prepping their fans for passing on him and making it sound like the reason isn’t just money (which it probably is).

[Obinna]

9 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

Yeah, that’s what I meant- I think the season he went and scored all those goals he was a winger, then became a WB and had a really tough season, then Preston played him as a winger and he looked awesome. Forgot he was on the right.

Just sounds like they’re prepping their fans for passing on him and making it sound like the reason isn’t just money (which it probably is).

To be fair to Liam, Basel struggled as a whole and still haven't fully recovered. That's important context. Hard to shine when everything around you is shambolic. 

[InglewoodJack]

3 minutes ago, Obinna said:

To be fair to Liam, Basel struggled as a whole and still haven't fully recovered. That's important context. Hard to shine when everything around you is shambolic. 

Of course, but I think he’s more than proven that he is a much more effective winger than a wingback, so it would be strange to send him back to that position. I don’t think he’s worth the transfer fee if that’s how they want to play him, but if someone wants to bring him in as a winger, it’s good business. 
 

Not a knock on Liam, just not his best position. 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

21 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

Of course, but I think he’s more than proven that he is a much more effective winger than a wingback, so it would be strange to send him back to that position. I don’t think he’s worth the transfer fee if that’s how they want to play him, but if someone wants to bring him in as a winger, it’s good business. 
 

Not a knock on Liam, just not his best position. 

Not sure I agree with either of your last posts and maybe its terminology but he has done really well at wingback/wide midfielder, what every you want to call it, in front of a back 3.

 

I can think of the win against Bristol City where they played a back 4 and he played really well as a winger.

The other standout games for me 

- The loss to Leeds when he had an assist

- The win against Leeds - 1 goal 1 assist (goal of the season)

- The win against Huddersfield (limited minutes) 

- The win against Blackburn

- The win against Coventry

- He even contributed an assist when Watford beat them 1-5

 

All those are him playing what is normally called wingback in my circles. 

 

Edited June 18 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[InglewoodJack]

2 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Not sure I agree with either of your last posts and maybe its terminology but he has done really well at wingback/wide midfielder, what every you want to call it, in front of a back 3.

 

I can think of the win against Bristol City where they played a back 4 and he played really well as a winger.

The other standout games for me 

- The loss to Leeds when he had an assist

- The win against Leeds - 1 goal 1 assist (goal of the season)

- The win against Huddersfield (limited minutes) 

- The win against Blackburn

- The win against Coventry

- He even contributed an assist when Watford beat them 1-5

 

All those are him playing what is normally called wingback in my circles. 

 

Maybe it is terminology- I think what makes him a special player is his ability to make these daring runs really deep, take on a man towards the box and either fire from deep or find a striker in the penalty area. When he’s a WB, and I’m thinking more of him at Basel vs. Leeds, he starts his runs from deeper, less chance to get into a dangerous area, the run fizzles out. He ends up with all these great underlying stats but no end product. Feel like at Preston he gets much more forward and was able to be dangerous in dangerous areas. If that is also considered a WB, so be it, but he was deployed in a more offensive position at PNE than at Basel.

Re: that Leeds game, he got his (beautiful) assist off a set piece, so his position was not as relevant, however, on the following Leeds goal in transition, Leeds start their run in transition just north of the center line in their zone with Millar guarding the ball carrier. His man gets a pass off, they zip it down the field fast, and as the play is going towards PNE’s net, Millar starts to hover about where he is in the screenshot below, looking like he’s waiting for PNE to win the ball back and hit him with an outlet pass so he can do what he does best- chaotic run in transition that ends up with a scoring chance before the opponent can organize. Instead, this happens:

#20 scores a relatively easy goal on a nice cross into pretty open space. Saying this less to call LM out for bad defensive work, maybe a centre back could’ve shifted over or something, but it’s clear that he had his eye on the breakout play, not marking his man, and that ended up with a goal. I think reducing his defensive ability to allow him to be more creative is the best way to get the best out of him.

This is just one play I picked out because I do remember the Leeds game being one of his better, but I think when you reduce his defensive responsibilities and avoid the distance he has to run back on defence when his club doesn’t have the ball, the better you’ll get out of him. 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

24 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

Maybe it is terminology- I think what makes him a special player is his ability to make these daring runs really deep, take on a man towards the box and either fire from deep or find a striker in the penalty area. When he’s a WB, and I’m thinking more of him at Basel vs. Leeds, he starts his runs from deeper, less chance to get into a dangerous area, the run fizzles out. He ends up with all these great underlying stats but no end product. Feel like at Preston he gets much more forward and was able to be dangerous in dangerous areas. If that is also considered a WB, so be it, but he was deployed in a more offensive position at PNE than at Basel.

Re: that Leeds game, he got his (beautiful) assist off a set piece, so his position was not as relevant, however, on the following Leeds goal in transition, Leeds start their run in transition just north of the center line in their zone with Millar guarding the ball carrier. His man gets a pass off, they zip it down the field fast, and as the play is going towards PNE’s net, Millar starts to hover about where he is in the screenshot below, looking like he’s waiting for PNE to win the ball back and hit him with an outlet pass so he can do what he does best- chaotic run in transition that ends up with a scoring chance before the opponent can organize. Instead, this happens:

#20 scores a relatively easy goal on a nice cross into pretty open space. Saying this less to call LM out for bad defensive work, maybe a centre back could’ve shifted over or something, but it’s clear that he had his eye on the breakout play, not marking his man, and that ended up with a goal. I think reducing his defensive ability to allow him to be more creative is the best way to get the best out of him.

This is just one play I picked out because I do remember the Leeds game being one of his better, but I think when you reduce his defensive responsibilities and avoid the distance he has to run back on defence when his club doesn’t have the ball, the better you’ll get out of him. 

Yeah you can do that from wingback, if especially if its a system you know well and your manager uses your centre backs creatively.  When you are attacking with wingbacks, the wide centre backs should know to push out and provide both an outlet and covering defence for the wide player (the wingback).  A midfielder often drops deep for central cover. 

Probably too often, as the season wore on, it broke down for Preston, but it is seems to be the system that they are committed to under Ryan Low. 

 

I think people think wingback means trying to make 5 at the back sound sexier.  Which to be fair some managers do but it is a fraction of the different ways it is used.

 

The way I saw it Liam played very little winger at Preston - the system didn't use them -  and the handful of games he played there, were not generally his best. He certainly did not line up in the most forward area like a winger and alway had significant defensive responsibilties.  We saw how important the latter was for Canada.  I think what makes him special is a least partially is his two-way play, his final ball still needs work, if we are honest. 

Edit: Remember Frimpong - Leverkusen took Europe by storm with him playing wingback.  That's the kind of player you can put there and be sucessful. 

Edited June 18 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[InglewoodJack]

36 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Yeah you can do that from wingback, if especially if its a system you know well and your manager uses your centre backs creatively.  When you are attacking with wingbacks, the wide centre backs should know to push out and provide both an outlet and covering defence for the wide player (the wingback).  A midfielder often drops deep for central cover. 

Probably too often, as the season wore on, it broke down for Preston, but it is seems to be the system that they are committed to under Ryan Low. 

 

I think people think wingback means trying to make 5 at the back sound sexier.  Which to be fair some managers do but it is a fraction of the different ways it is used.

 

The way I saw it Liam played very little winger at Preston - the system didn't use them -  and the handful of games he played there, were not generally his best. He certainly did not line up in the most forward area like a winger and alway had significant defensive responsibilties.  We saw how important the latter was for Canada.  I think what makes him special is a least partially is his two-way play, his final ball still needs work, if we are honest. 

Edit: Remember Frimpong - Leverkusen took Europe by storm with him playing wingback.  That's the kind of player you can put there and be sucessful. 

I don't disagree with what you're saying- especially re: his final product especially (funny enough, in the Leeds game above, he took an identical shot to the one he took against France- dribbles into the box, tries and curls it top corner, barely misses). I would say that having him play farther up the pitch, reducing his defensive responsibilities and how quickly he needs to fall back on defense in transition will help him get into better areas, start his runs deeper, and not have to take these low percentage (hate that term) shots because they're the best he can get from where he's starting off. 

As for the player though, I think he's pretty determined to be a winger. He's said it on numerous occasions and fairly certain that dad has posted that here as well. I think based on PNE having already cast doubt on whether they could actually afford to buy him from Basel, them coming out and already saying there's a disagreement over where they'd play him does seem like it was put out there so that when he goes to Sunderland or Leeds or wherever next year (two rumours, think both play wingers) they can just tell the fans that it wasn't the money, it was he wanted one thing and PNE wanted another, so it wasn't a fit.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

13 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

I don't disagree with what you're saying- especially re: his final product especially (funny enough, in the Leeds game above, he took an identical shot to the one he took against France- dribbles into the box, tries and curls it top corner, barely misses). I would say that having him play farther up the pitch, reducing his defensive responsibilities and how quickly he needs to fall back on defense in transition will help him get into better areas, start his runs deeper, and not have to take these low percentage (hate that term) shots because they're the best he can get from where he's starting off. 

As for the player though, I think he's pretty determined to be a winger. He's said it on numerous occasions and fairly certain that dad has posted that here as well. I think based on PNE having already cast doubt on whether they could actually afford to buy him from Basel, them coming out and already saying there's a disagreement over where they'd play him does seem like it was put out there so that when he goes to Sunderland or Leeds or wherever next year (two rumours, think both play wingers) they can just tell the fans that it wasn't the money, it was he wanted one thing and PNE wanted another, so it wasn't a fit.

I hope that with knowledge that I'm just a nobody on a forum, but one who watches too much football and tries to be honest in the face of  all my biases, I can still say, even to him, I would disagree and think he plays great at wingback, probably more so than winger at this point.

 

But maybe as you say it's all moot at Preston. They take their team seriously and placating those supporters is not always a straightforward task. So a bit of truth massaging is not unheard of.

 

Here's hoping for huge showings  in the next few weeks that will open the way for lots of good options.

Edited June 18 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[costarg]

21 hours ago, PegCityCam said:

Put Liam down as another player who needs to get outta dodge 😐

 

Honesty from both sides.  Even if it is a PR move, it shows this club values it's fans and communicates properly.  Classy and shows a lot of transparency.  I'm an even bigger fan of PNE and Liam after this.  Respect. 

[InglewoodJack]

 

[Obinna]

Millar, Bombito, Kone, David, and Davies could all potentially be on the move.

I hope these rumours have legs though. Remember in the lead up to World Cup where everyone was seemingly linked to Besiktas? Kamal Miller, Joel Waterman, Richie Laryea, and even ZBG were linked with them, if I recall correctly. 

[TGAA_Star]

1 minute ago, Obinna said:

Millar, Bombito, Kone, David, and Davies could all potentially be on the move.

I hope these rumours have legs though. Remember in the lead up to World Cup where everyone was seemingly linked to Besiktas? Kamal Miller, Joel Waterman, Richie Laryea, and even ZBG were linked with them, if I recall correctly. 

Besiktas for Liam would be decent 

[Obinna]

Just now, TGAA_Star said:

Besiktas for Liam would be decent 

I'd prefer a move elsewhere. Besiktas seem to struggle now a days to hold onto their top-3 status in the Super Lig, plus I don't really think moving to Turkey from the Championship is an upgrade. 

I think he should go for a high Championship/low Premier league opportunity. Probably time to test himself in the Prem if the chance is there. 

[frmr]

A bottom half EPL side would be awesome for Millar. Wolves, Fulham, Bournemouth, somewhere in there.

[TGAA_Star]

5 minutes ago, frmr said:

A bottom half EPL side would be awesome for Millar. Wolves, Fulham, Bournemouth, somewhere in there.

Out of those then probably Fulham because he would get to be club mates with LDF

[Obinna]

Just now, TGAA_Star said:

Out of those then probably Fulham because he would get to be club mates with LDF

Played some youth ball there before joining Liverpool, I believe. 

[Atlantic]

 

[narduch]

So staying in the Championship. 

[frmr]

Considering the confused emoji from spitfire, I'm guessing that's not the case.