Corazon Posted May 21 Share Posted May 21 (edited) Has not been included in England's 33 man preliminary squad despite Southgate listing approximately 8 center backs on this preliminary squad. That means that as he turns 27 later this year, he will have been excluded out of the Euro 2020 & Euro 2024 and the World Cup in 2022. As @masster mentions above, he hasn't been at his best this season and his time with England may be coming to an end. Perhaps a new face after Southgate will give him an opportunity. But at this point, it's probably fair to say that he likely has some regrets on choosing England over Canada. Only 5 caps for England but he would have a World Cup & soon to be Copa America (along with several Nations Leagues & Gold Cups) if he chose Canada. Edited May 21 by Corazon narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadenge Posted May 21 Share Posted May 21 (edited) 2 hours ago, Corazon said: Has not been included in England's 33 man preliminary squad despite Southgate listing approximately 8 center backs on this preliminary squad. That means that as he turns 27 later this year, he will have been excluded out of the Euro 2020 & Euro 2024 and the World Cup in 2022. As @masster mentions above, he hasn't been at his best this season and his time with England may be coming to an end. Perhaps a new face after Southgate will give him an opportunity. But at this point, it's probably fair to say that he likely has some regrets on choosing England over Canada. Only 5 caps for England but he would have a World Cup & soon to be Copa America (along with several Nations Leagues & Gold Cups) if he chose Canada. Lesson for Jebbo, who I doubt has a chance with England, but also Luca. You gotta be one of the best at your positions to make a top 10/20 nation. I should add Sigur as well. Edited May 21 by Kadenge Corazon, narduch and Jack1997 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted May 21 Share Posted May 21 6 minutes ago, Kadenge said: Lesson for Jebbo, who I doubt has a chance with England, but also Luca. You gotta be one of the best at your positions to make a top 10/20 nation. I should add Sigur as well. Tomori and Mitrovic both make our Copa squad if available. Both will miss the Euros jordan, Jack1997 and Corazon 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack1997 Posted May 21 Share Posted May 21 2 hours ago, narduch said: Tomori and Mitrovic both make our Copa squad if available. Both will miss the Euros Hell Sigur probably does too, their losses though. Corazon and narduch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 22 Share Posted May 22 Dead and buried still for me... Until FIFA decides to change the rules again. Corazon and YorkRegionFan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corazon Posted May 22 Share Posted May 22 1 hour ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said: Dead and buried still for me... Until FIFA decides to change the rules again. Knowing our luck, they’d “change the rule” or make an “exception” and then he would go and choose Nigeria. Borjans Sweatpants and WestHamCanadianinOxford 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony7 Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 At least Lookman made the right decision, lol. Southgate tried to trap him as well, smh. Tomori should have really considered Nigeria as well. I can see them making noise in 2026. Karma will get Southgate in the Euros, likely costing his job. Calling it now. narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 7 hours ago, anthony7 said: At least Lookman made the right decision, lol. Southgate tried to trap him as well, smh. Tomori should have really considered Nigeria as well. I can see them making noise in 2026. Karma will get Southgate in the Euros, likely costing his job. Calling it now. People talk like these players have no agency (and didn't grow up in England supporting English teams.) Don't love all aspects of the rules, but we just started the process with Luc de Fougerolles. (3 years earlier).He didn't deserve a cap... yet. It's the way of the football these days. Southgate will eventually lose his job for mishandling the potential of the players he has picked. Not for those he didn't. Metro and narduch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 15 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said: People talk like these players have no agency (and didn't grow up in England supporting English teams.) Its the age of materialism, I guess. Deciding with your heart is irrelevant. 😉 I keep reading on Twitter/X how Tomori made the correct "professional decision", even though "professionally", he'd be better off playing in Copa America than nowhere. phresh, WestHamCanadianinOxford and narduch 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 By the way, this what I remember Lookman for There is a redemption arc out there for a lot of us 😁. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony7 Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 (edited) 5 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said: People talk like these players have no agency (and didn't grow up in England supporting English teams.) Don't love all aspects of the rules, but we just started the process with Luc de Fougerolles. (3 years earlier).He didn't deserve a cap... yet. It's the way of the football these days. Southgate will eventually lose his job for mishandling the potential of the players he has picked. Not for those he didn't. You’re missing my point. Lookman’s situation was a textbook case of Southgate trying to trap a player to have in his pool even though he may not be used at all. Thank god he made the right the decision and chose Nigeria. The Tomori situation stings even more now knowing what could have been with Nigeria as well as Canada. Jose Mourinho said it best. A lot of these players of African descent should consider playing for their parents countries. It grows the game globally and it shows the richness in talent of these countries at a global stage. Now looking in hindsight, Nigeria would have been the best decision for Tomori. Nigeria will be an AFCON contender for many years to come and there going to be a dark horse team in the 2026 World Cup. Edited May 23 by anthony7 narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 (edited) 16 minutes ago, anthony7 said: You’re missing my point. Lookman’s situation was a textbook case of Southgate trying to trap a player to have in his pool even though he may not be used at all. Thank god he made the right the decision and chose Nigeria. The Tomori situation stings even more now knowing what could have been with Nigeria as well as Canada. Jose Mourinho said it best. A lot of these players of African descent should consider playing for their parents countries. It grows the game globally and it shows richness in talent of these countries at a global stage. Now looking in hindsight, Nigeria would have been the best decision for Tomori. Nigeria will be an AFCON contender for many years to come and there going to be a dark horse team in the 2026 World Cup. Everybody tries to "trap" players they see with potential. They then make their decisions - smart or otherwise. Not sure how karma comes into it, unless it is coming to bite us first. We capped at player who has never played a senior league game, Tomori at least had a few appearances in the Championship at that age (and wasn't capped from almost 3 years). I don't like Southgate for lots of reasons and would like the rules to be different but hugely hypocritical of me to condemn Tomori and approve of De Fougerolles (which I do). Edited May 23 by WestHamCanadianinOxford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony7 Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 Just now, WestHamCanadianinOxford said: Everybody tries to "trap" players they see with potential. They then make their decisions - smart or otherwise. Not sure how karma comes into it, unless it is coming to bite us first. We capped at player who has never played a senior league game, Tomori at least had a few appearances in the Championship at that age. I don't like Southgate for lots of reasons and would like the rules to be different but hugely hypocritical of me to condemn Tomori and approve of De Fougerolles (which I do). It’s karma because Southgate is not being honest with these players. He is only looking at his best interests and not the players. Southgate should be honest with these players from the jump with regards to their chances of repping England. Like it’s ludicrous that Tomori is not on the provisional squad and now he is trapped with England and probably just through away his international future. Nigeria misses out on a player who probably boost their chances of success on the global stage. These players need to consider giving back to Africa where they’ll be respected and can thrive. Like we saw with Rashford, Sancho and Saka at the last Euros. When these players mess up they’re not considered English anymore they’re now second class citizens. WestHamCanadianinOxford 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 1 minute ago, anthony7 said: It’s karma because Southgate is not being honest with these players. He is only looking at his best interests and not the players. Southgate should be honest with these players from the jump with regards to their chances of repping England. Like it’s ludicrous that Tomori is not on the provisional squad and now he is trapped with England and probably just through away his international future. Nigeria misses out on a player who probably boost their chances of success on the global stage. These players need to consider giving back to Africa where they’ll be respected and can thrive. Like we saw with Rashford, Sancho and Saka at the last Euros. When these players mess up they’re not considered English anymore they’re now second class citizens. We have no idea what he said to these players. And he's not an agent ; he's supposed to make the England the best they can be, not further the career of every player that might have a chance to play for the national side. Again, I would like rule changes but these are the rules as written and the player (and his representatives) have some responsiblity to chart their own future. Again, we are doing this, is karma going to bite us? I have questioned the exclusion of Tomori on here many times, but I don't think it's a huge mistake this time, certainly not ludicrous. There are younger players that are getting a look that are playing extremely well, and he was not going to be a starter. Sorry but your last couple sentences are rubbish. I was there. Every single England player, if they mess up, is treated like a second class citizen by idiots, whether it's refering to them, their Wags or their appearance or whatever. It's not right but it is common if you are in the biggest sport in a country with a rabid and very frustrated fanbase. (I look at the stupidity I just saw between Canucks and Oilers fans - the first year I have been really paying attention to hockey on social media.) You have some personal feelings about it it seems and I respect that, but not sure that makes for reasonable points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corazon Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 Lookman's decision to finally commit to Nigeria over England has worked out well for his career. His two best seasons have been with Atalanta since he chose to represent Nigeria. In regards to cap tying, I don't think a smaller nation should have any beneficial treatment over an elite national program perse. However, England cap tying certain players feels a bit different to me than us cap-tying LDF who probably fully understands that him cracking the England program is a long shot. It would feel a bit different if LDF was from Guyana or Phillipines and we capped him when we did. That being said, Tomori absolutely justified being a fringe callup for England and in my opinion should have been included on several England teams early on in his AC Milan career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony7 Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 (edited) 59 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said: We have no idea what he said to these players. And he's not an agent ; he's supposed to make the England the best they can be, not further the career of every player that might have a chance to play for the national side. Again, I would like rule changes but these are the rules as written and the player (and his representatives) have some responsiblity to chart their own future. Again, we are doing this, is karma going to bite us? I have questioned the exclusion of Tomori on here many times, but I don't think it's a huge mistake this time, certainly not ludicrous. There are younger players that are getting a look that are playing extremely well, and he was not going to be a starter. Sorry but your last couple sentences are rubbish. I was there. Every single England player, if they mess up, is treated like a second class citizen by idiots, whether it's refering to them, their Wags or their appearance or whatever. It's not right but it is common if you are in the biggest sport in a country with a rabid and very frustrated fanbase. (I look at the stupidity I just saw between Canucks and Oilers fans - the first year I have been really paying attention to hockey on social media.) You have some personal feelings about it it seems and I respect that, but not sure that makes for reasonable points. Tomori being snubbed from the provisional squad is ludicrous. Like WTF, are you dumb? I’m a Man United fan. Maguire is no good. Shaw has been essentially MIA for the season and you expect him to be match fit for the euros when he is already known for his weight problems. And Quansah is too young and raw. The occasion could get to him and you most likely get another screw up like he did against Man Utd. Tomori is 27, in his PRIME and literally won the Serie A not to long ago. Your telling me he can’t get into the provisional squad? GTFOH!! In terms of Rashford, Saka, and Sancho I was referring to the shit ton of racism these players received which was completely disgusting. I guess you were living under a rock and didn’t notice? England doesn’t value the talents of their African descendant players. They will turn on them in an instant without question. What I’m trying to say is that these future dual nats of African origin should start to think of playing for countries where they’re valued and not tolerated. Edited May 23 by anthony7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestHamCanadianinOxford Posted May 23 Share Posted May 23 (edited) 1 hour ago, anthony7 said: Tomori being snubbed from the provisional squad is ludicrous. Like WTF, are you dumb? I’m a Man United fan. Maguire is no good. Shaw has been essentially MIA for the season and you expect him to be match fit for the euros when he is already known for his weight problems. And Quansah is too young and raw. The occasion could get to him and you most likely get another screw up like he did against Man Utd. Tomori is 27, in his PRIME and literally won the Serie A not to long ago. Your telling me he can’t get into the provisional squad? GTFOH!! In terms of Rashford, Saka, and Sancho I was referring to the shit ton of racism these players received which was completely disgusting. I guess you were living under a rock and didn’t notice? England doesn’t value the talents of their African descendant players. They will turn on them in an instant without question. What I’m trying to say is that these future dual nats of African origin should start to think of playing for countries where they’re valued and not tolerated. Insults and internet abbreviations aren't going to mean much to me or convince me you have a point. Probably the opposite. Maguire played less than month ago and might make the Cup final, he has had a good season. We know Shaw is a long shot. Quansah's not starting if he's going. I know exactly what you were talking about. A lot came from supporters of rival clubs. Racism is one of many kinds of abuse which happens when England or a club loses. Death threats are another. It is too much but is not exclusive to those players. When player "get" others red-carded in club matches, there have been death threats. You believe a certain way, fair enough, but those players continue to play for England and often say they are proud to do so. And the reality of the FA and the nation as whole valuing them is very different than what you have been told, I would say. Edited May 23 by WestHamCanadianinOxford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corazon Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Not included in the first Post-Southgate England roster. narduch and ahmedou 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barthez-Battalion Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 2 hours ago, Corazon said: Not included in the first Post-Southgate England roster. ayyyy lmaoooo ahmedou 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympique_de_Marseille Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 3 hours ago, Corazon said: Not included in the first Post-Southgate England roster. 57 minutes ago, Barthez-Battalion said: ayyyy lmaoooo https://www.englandfootball.com/articles/2024/Aug/29/england-mens-senior-squad-announcement-republic-of-ireland-finland-20242908 ahmedou 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 I just noticed that the guy who started this thread was the same guy who was insufferable in Jonathan de Guzman thread nolando 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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