Scott Arfield

[Ruffian]

He didn't have much impact in his first game. it looked like people were hesitant to pass to him. I can see him being a sometimes starter and sometimes of the bench guy there.

[narduch]

39 minutes ago, Ruffian said:

He didn't have much impact in his first game. it looked like people were hesitant to pass to him. I can see him being a sometimes starter and sometimes of the bench guy there.

He had one good scoring chance early after nut megging an opponent but was stopped by a defender because he probably took took many touches 

[Watchmen]

Make of it what you will.

 

[costarg]

7 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Make of it what you will.

 

Oh boy, here we go, get the popcorn ready!

[InglewoodJack]

Yeah obviously he’s more interested lol. Sorry Choiniere clears 

[Floortom]

I dont think it will happen but he would have been a big help at the Gold Cup when we had Fraser, Spoony taking up minutes

[BearcatSA]

21 minutes ago, costarg said:

Oh boy, here we go, get the popcorn ready!

Yes.

Let's see if we can amp up his player thread with more pages of posts.  He's only a 168 pages behind "The Importance of Alphonso Davies" thread!

C'mon, let's make it happen!

[trc2014]

Yeah I’m sure the guys who travelled half way around the world for qualifiers against 160th ranked teams will be thrilled to welcome him back now that it’s convenient travel for him. 

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

4 minutes ago, trc2014 said:

Yeah I’m sure the guys who travelled half way around the world for qualifiers against 160th ranked teams will be thrilled to welcome him back now that it’s convenient travel for him. 

1) He gets a fresh start with many. Even a guy who is a veteran now like Alistair has been brought in since.

2) The other guys know he wasn't at the World Cup and they know why. To the victor go the spoils and he wasn't there to help qualify, but that cycle is over.

3) He's not going to get the armband again.

4) Copa America 2024 is a new cycle. New effort. New chance to prove himself if he is up for it and Herdman is willing.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Olympique_de_Marseille

[Shway]

Oh fack off.

 We're building not rehashing.

 

[Watchmen]

28 minutes ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

1) He gets a fresh start with many. Even a guy who is a veteran now like Alistair has been brought in since.

2) The other guys know he wasn't at the World Cup and they know why. To the victor go the spoils and he wasn't there to help qualify, but that cycle is over.

3) He's not going to get the armband again.

4) Copa America 2024 is a new cycle. New effort. New chance to prove himself if he is up for it and Herdman is willing.

This tends to be my feeling. I don't know how the guys in the locker room feel. But he didn't help them qualify for the WC and he didn't get to go (ie he wasn't rewarded for it). Possibly missed out on a once in a life time opportunity. If he's decided he'd like to come back now, that's a team decision. 

[frmr]

Nah.

[Unnamed Trialist]

35 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

This tends to be my feeling. I don't know how the guys in the locker room feel. But he didn't help them qualify for the WC and he didn't get to go (ie he wasn't rewarded for it). Possibly missed out on a once in a life time opportunity. If he's decided he'd like to come back now, that's a team decision. 

Sam Piette was a loyal player, helped us qualify, been there for us through thick and thin, then didn't get a single minute in Qatar so Wotherspoon or Fraser could do the proverbial uninspiring run out. Piette was rewarded with his loyalty with nothing from Herdman.

Point is: if being there means so little, why should not being there mean so much?

[Obinna]

I am not gun-ho on Arfield coming back, but I wouldn't hate it either.

I like how @Olympique_de_Marseille lays it out, well said. And to put a bow on @Watchmen's comment, I would say that since he didn't help qualify and didn't get a spot at the WC, it's no harm no foul, water under the bridge, new beginnings, or however else we want to phrase it. Unless there is a team or coach issue, I don't think Arfield should be blocked from the National Team for "abandoning" the team. The past is the past and the new cycle is already underway.

All of that said, he obviously needs to earn his place. This should require him to outperform the likes of Choniere and Ahmed - young players we need to see more. He needs to be significantly better than both in my eyes to earn the call. By contrast, Osorio doesn't have to be significantly better. He's already well integrated into the team, plus I suppose we could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt for always answering the call.

Now, what I would say is that if Oso is playing like crap and/or needs a rest or has picked up an injury, then I am okay with Arfield coming in to play the veteran role. Or, if Spoony ends up in MLS and is going to round out a roster, I am okay with Arfield taking his spot if his play is superior in the same league. I just don't want to see Arfield prioritized over Choniere or Ahmed - unless of course he's killing MLS which I very much doubt will happen. 

In fact, I very much doubt we see Arfield again period, so this is probably just me speculating on a fantasy. 

 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

4 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I am not gun-ho on Arfield coming back, but I wouldn't hate it either.

I like how @Olympique_de_Marseille lays it out, well said. And to put a bow on @Watchmen's comment, I would say that since he didn't help qualify and didn't get a spot at the WC, it's no harm no foul, water under the bridge, new beginnings, or however else we want to phrase it. Unless there is a team or coach issue, I don't think Arfield should be blocked from the National Team for "abandoning" the team. The past is the past and the new cycle is already underway.

All of that said, he obviously needs to earn his place. This should require him to outperform the likes of Choniere and Ahmed - young players we need to see more. He needs to be significantly better than both in my eyes to earn the call. By contrast, Osorio doesn't have to be significantly better. He's already well integrated into the team, plus I suppose we could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt for always answering the call.

Now, what I would say is that if Oso is playing like crap and/or needs a rest or has picked up an injury, then I am okay with Arfield coming in to play the veteran role. Or, if Spoony ends up in MLS and is going to round out a roster, I am okay with Arfield taking his spot if his play is superior in the same league. I just don't want to see Arfield prioritized over Choniere or Ahmed - unless of course he's killing MLS which I very much doubt will happen. 

In fact, I very much doubt we see Arfield again period, so this is probably just me speculating on a fantasy. 

 

I like Arfield more than most on here it seems.  He was at Burnley (a friend of mine when I was in England's dad played for them, so have soft spot) and Rangers who are my Old Firm team of choice. 

 

But I think we need to look younger, any baggage not even considered.

[Kadenge]

Need to get younger not older. During WCQ we had a good balance of vets and young players...vets provided  leadership, something that  the US were lacking. But it was evident during the GC that some of those vets don't have the legs to keep up anymore. Need to continue to blood  younger players into the squad and build now for 2026. 

[kacbru]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

Oh fack off.

 We're building not rehashing.

 

Apparently we are rehashing...

He said he retired from international football, and ever since it has been "maybe, I'm open to considering it, Herdman's a great guy...etc.".  Hey Scotty, grow some balls and take a stand - either say you want to come out of retirement or say you don't.

[dyslexic nam]

That’s a no for me dawg. 

I was ready to welcome him back for Qatar.  Would have even forgiven the lack of participation in qualifiers.  But now, after Qatar, when we are looking to build for 2026?  Nah.  At this point I would rather give the minutes to to young guys and groom the next generation.  

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

15 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

when we are looking to build for 2026?

We are looking to qualify and then possibly do well at the Copa America 2024.

26 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

Need to get younger not older.

1 hour ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

But I think we need to look younger

If he still has legs by this time next year then let's include him in the squad.

We want the best 23 we can for that tournament (assuming we qualify).

Edited July 12, 2023 by Olympique_de_Marseille

[johnyb]

Said it before I'll say it again. We needed him for WC2022, would've welcomed him with open arms if he came back for that. Doubt he'd even make the team for 2026, hard No now.

[eramosat]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Sam Piette was a loyal player, helped us qualify, been there for us through thick and thin, then didn't get a single minute in Qatar so Wotherspoon or Fraser could do the proverbial uninspiring run out. Piette was rewarded with his loyalty with nothing from Herdman.

Point is: if being there means so little, why should not being there mean so much?

This tortured logic belongs in your Top 10 All Time Bamboozle Attempts (you try to bamboozle us, don't you).  Right?  

Thank you for keeping a pointless front-page discussion of the suitability of a former CANMNT great to get more CANMNT minutes, and whose time seems to have passed in most respects...Light?

Good luck in Miami Scott, or wherever you have landed. Good Night!

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by eramosat

[Obinna]

Are these "No" takes just emotional? Because if I am going by emotion I can easily say hell naw like many of you, but if I am thinking about the team and putting emotion aside, I can reluctantly say: sure bring him in, provided it is not at the expense of a younger player and provided he is playing well.

In other words, if he can help the team and it doesn't negatively impact the development of Choniere and Ahmed, players who need to be integrated. Why not? Because he screwed us over? Hell, if he didn't step aside maybe Kone isn't as far along in his NT career. 

And by the way, if they are simply emotional takes its all good too, because I get it. Not trying to pick fights or make it seem like I am a an Arfield truther. I am just trying to understand how much of the objections are emotional vs tactics/development/etc.

[Watchmen]

51 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

That’s a no for me dawg. 

I was ready to welcome him back for Qatar.  Would have even forgiven the lack of participation in qualifiers.  But now, after Qatar, when we are looking to build for 2026?  Nah.  At this point I would rather give the minutes to to young guys and groom the next generation.  

I see Copa 2024 being more of his swan song. I wouldn't be so much rewarding him as I'd like to see the team perform better at the next major event, and I think he could help with that from a depth perspective. But that's all I'm thinking of him now is depth, as I think the GC showed us we don't have as much of that as we'd like. Still plenty of opportunities for younger players though.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

2 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Are these "No" takes just emotional? Because if I am going by emotion I can easily say hell naw like many of you, but if I am thinking about the team and putting emotion aside, I can reluctantly say: sure bring him in, provided it is not at the expense of a younger player and provided he is playing well.

In other words, if he can help the team and it doesn't negatively impact the development of Choniere and Ahmed, players who need to be integrated. Why not? Because he screwed us over? Hell, if he didn't step aside maybe Kone isn't as far along in his NT career. 

And by the way, if they are simply emotional takes its all good too, because I get it. Not trying to pick fights or make it seem like I am a an Arfield truther. I am just trying to understand how much of the objections are emotional vs tactics/development/etc.

Honestly, we need faster and stronger than him in other spots in midfield.  We have players that play his game, some better - Staq, first, Osorio, Ahmed maybe.  If we are going to compete with the best in CONCACAF and most at the Copa America, in my opinion, we need destroyers in there.  Hopefully that's not all they do, but people like Kone needs to bring that and maybe that's why Bombito got the looks he did.  

[canuckgbp]