Scott Arfield

[MauditYvon]

3 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

What? Are you disagreeing that his public retirement was not on the day he officially announced it? 

His public retirement was official the day he made it public. I’m talking about the 2020-2021 period. Covid, family, Rangers playing CL, made the GC preliminary roster, coach at club saying he retired from NT, Canada not even part of the Hex, etc. Nothing clear.

Do you have a source about what you pretended earlier?

Edited September 5, 2023 by MauditYvon

[Obinna]

Just now, Bigandy said:

I question that the issue was flying. He made the trek out for many games that were played in canada and the USA. He didnt make the trip for central american games. 

He may have said he didnt want to fly across the atlantic but when you read between the lines, its the central american games that were more of an issue. Its not like he can come out and say "I only want to play the games that have favourable conditions".

I guess we can each make of it as we want, which suggests nobody really knows, but for me it seemed that everything was fine until his minutes at Rangers were under threat. He had no trouble flying to and fro to play the United States in NL. I have no memory of him playing against Cuba in the same tournament, so perhaps there is some truth to it, but we are also extrapolating Cuba to mean all CA Nations.

Cuba isn't even CA anyways. 

Anyways, the narrative that he doesn't want to play minnows took a life of its own but really it was just Cuba he skipped out on as far as we know. From there he turned down all games due to Rangers committments - some big like against USA and Mexico, others small like against Aruba or Bermuda, which ironically were hosted in the states.

[Bigandy]

If you look at his match by match, he has only played in central america once against hondorous. My sentiment is not that he skips the minnows. Its that he skips away matches in central america. 

 https://canadasoccer.com/profile/?id=6727&teamId=2068#tab2

[Bigandy]

8 minutes ago, MauditYvon said:

His public retirement was official the day he made it public. I’m talking about the 2020-2021 period. Covid, family, Rangers playing CL, made the GC preliminary roster, coach at club saying he retired from NT, Canada not even part of the Hex, etc. Nothing clear.

Do you have a source about what you pretended earlier?

Im confused. you asked me when he retired and I gave you a source for his official announcement.  What information are you asking me for if not that? 

[MauditYvon]

1 minute ago, Bigandy said:

Im confused. you asked me when he retired and I gave you a source for his official announcement.  What information are you asking me for if not that? 

(herdman invited him for WCQ and he rejected them and then retired when herdman wouldnt select him for the nice games)

[Bigandy]

1 minute ago, MauditYvon said:

(herdman invited him for WCQ and he rejected them and then retired when herdman wouldnt select him for the nice games)

I just took this as a general assumption. Do you think herdman didnt invite the guy he made captain to play against bermuda? 

[Obinna]

3 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

If you look at his match by match, he has only played in central america once against hondorous. My sentiment is not that he skips the minnows. Its that he skips away matches in central america. 

 https://canadasoccer.com/profile/?id=6727&teamId=2068#tab2

Thanks for digging that up I was wondering that. Wouldn't it go against your point though? He played in CA already and when the time came to play there again he was already getting pressure from Rangers/Gerrard to skip games, so maybe a lot of it was that more than anything. Who knows though I guess.

Either way, if he didn't want to fly down there because of distance it's moot because he now plays on Charlotte. If he just didn't want to play down there period it's moot because we only have one game down there for the remainder of the cycle.

[MauditYvon]

Just now, Bigandy said:

I just took this as a general assumption.

Enjoy your evening mate

[Ruffian]

7 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

If you look at his match by match, he has only played in central america once against hondorous. My sentiment is not that he skips the minnows. Its that he skips away matches in central america. 

 https://canadasoccer.com/profile/?id=6727&teamId=2068#tab2

The man may have only ever been to Canada 3 times in his life for those three games.

[Obinna]

Just now, Bigandy said:

I just took this as a general assumption. Do you think herdman didnt invite the guy he made captain to play against bermuda? 

Btw we played Bermuda in the USA (Orlando) and also they are not in central america they aren't even in the Caribbean.

[MauditYvon]

3 minutes ago, Ruffian said:

The man may have only ever been to Canada 3 times in his life for those three games.

He was in OneSoccer studio last.. September? 
 

Was in Montréal not even 2 months ago.

Edited September 5, 2023 by MauditYvon

[Bigandy]

2 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Thanks for digging that up I was wondering that. Wouldn't it go against your point though? He played in CA already and when the time came to play there again he was already getting pressure from Rangers/Gerrard to skip games, so maybe a lot of it was that more than anything. Who knows though I guess.

Either way, if he didn't want to fly down there because of distance it's moot because he now plays on Charlotte. If he just didn't want to play down there period it's moot because we only have one game down there for the remainder of the cycle.

Im for sure open to the pressures of rangers and believe it was a factor. However he skipped some away matches in CA then kept playing for Canada and then later on he got the rangers pressure. The pressure coincided with WCQ in 2021 but there was a time period between 2016-2019 that he didnt play away games but would play virgin islands in BC.  

[Obinna]

16 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

Im for sure open to the pressures of rangers and believe it was a factor. However he skipped some away matches in CA then kept playing for Canada and then later on he got the rangers pressure. The pressure coincided with WCQ in 2021 but there was a time period between 2016-2019 that he didnt play away games but would play virgin islands in BC.  

Do u happen to know which CA games he skipped out on? That got me curious 

[Shway]

Are you calling Arfield over Choiniere? Probably not.

Are you calling Arfield over Millar? 
Probably not.

Are you calling Arfield over Osorio?
Definitely not.

This affinity for Arfield has gone beyond sensible now. He's definitely not a leader, and since he's not it doesn't make sense to use his spot when we could go younger and prepare for the immediate future. 

He'll be 35 come the Copa America

[Bigandy]

22 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Do u happen to know which CA games he skipped out on? That got me curious 

I once did the research. It should be posted on this forum on earlier pages but I forget off the top of my head. I remember it wasnt as many games as I thought there would be, which obviously weakens the theory. 

[Obinna]

54 minutes ago, Shway said:

Are you calling Arfield over Choiniere? Probably not.

Are you calling Arfield over Millar? 
Probably not.

Are you calling Arfield over Osorio?
Definitely not.

This affinity for Arfield has gone beyond sensible now. He's definitely not a leader, and since he's not it doesn't make sense to use his spot when we could go younger and prepare for the immediate future. 

He'll be 35 come the Copa America

In a perfect world everyone is healthy and available, but injuries happen. You don't have to go far down the quality trail until you get to Arfield. I'm sure you can admit that.

IF Arfield is available in that situation then why not? It's not a matter of picking him over any of those guys, it's a matter of having all options available. I wouldn't mind if a new coach came in and Arfield came back into the pool, just as an option. That's not the same as he saying he should be selected over Osorio (good comparison) or Millar (strange comparison). I don't think either is true, although Oso worried me a bit at the Gold Cup.

I want the strongest possible squad. That may not include Arfield, but having him as an option and part of the discussion is not a bad thing, right? He would be an extra player available that we didn't have under Herdman. I am all for young players, because a big pool is important, but expanding the pool can be done at the other end of the pool too. If he is clearly past it then age matters. If he's not than it doesn't. 

Like it or not, as long as he's playing well or a new coach comes in and addresses it, the question will linger.

[Shway]

22 minutes ago, Obinna said:

In a perfect world everyone is healthy and available, but injuries happen. You don't have to go far down the quality trail until you get to Arfield. I'm sure you can admit that.

IF Arfield is available in that situation then why not? It's not a matter of picking him over any of those guys, it's a matter of having all options available. I wouldn't mind if a new coach came in and Arfield came back into the pool, just as an option. That's not the same as he saying he should be selected over Osorio (good comparison) or Millar (strange comparison). I don't think either is true, although Oso worried me a bit at the Gold Cup.

I want the strongest possible squad. That may not include Arfield, but having him as an option and part of the discussion is not a bad thing, right? He would be an extra player available that we didn't have under Herdman. I am all for young players, because a big pool is important, but expanding the pool can be done at the other end of the pool too. If he is clearly past it then age matters. If he's not than it doesn't. 

Like it or not, as long as he's playing well or a new coach comes in and addresses it, the question will linger.

I get what your saying ...but the last part of your statement pretty much sums up everything....it's not up to the new coach. Like @Bigandyhas already mentioned "he's retired".

The guys I was listing earlier weren't meant to be direct comparisons, but more so from different categories of new, fringe, and core players. 

[Obinna]

3 minutes ago, Shway said:

The guys I was listing earlier weren't meant to be direct comparisons, but more so from different categories of new, fringe, and core players. 

Oh okay gotcha. Fair enough.

4 minutes ago, Shway said:

I get what your saying ...but the last part of your statement pretty much sums up everything....it's not up to the new coach. Like @Bigandyhas already mentioned "he's retired".

It's both. Arfield would need to be willing to return to the team and the new coach would have to be interested in him. It's not an insurmountable mountain. Arfield is not retired from being a professional player. The pieces are in place if there is a willingness from both sides. 

[vancanman]

13 hours ago, Obinna said:

Btw we played Bermuda in the USA (Orlando) and also they are not in central america they aren't even in the Caribbean.

They're not even a country.

[costarg]

15 hours ago, Shway said:

Are you calling Arfield over Osorio?
Definitely not.

Honestly, If we're looking at the past 8-10 months, Yes, I'm taking Arfield over Osorio.  As much as I love the guy, he is nowhere near the Osorio we're known and loved in the past.  Hopefully he turns that around quick.

[costarg]

16 hours ago, PopePouri said:

So you take a blue cap tweet with no detail or explanation over what's actually been said in taped interviews?

[Obinna]

1 minute ago, costarg said:

Honestly, If we're looking at the past 8-10 months, Yes, I'm taking Arfield over Osorio.  As much as I love the guy, he is nowhere near the Osorio we're known and loved in the past.  Hopefully he turns that around quick.

That's a bold take, but not necessarily a crazy one. Osorio hasn't been at his best. If I am a new coach from the outside coming in and my priority is to take the most in form players at the moment, regardless of recent caps and such, Arfield vs. Osorio may be a tough call. They both have similar attributes and profiles and you may only want to take one, not necessarily both. I find it very hard to see Arfield in the national team with Osorio left at home, but that may just be because Osorio has been such a big part of the national team and Arfield has basically been done since 2019. 

[costarg]

6 minutes ago, Obinna said:

That's a bold take, but not necessarily a crazy one. Osorio hasn't been at his best. If I am a new coach from the outside coming in and my priority is to take the most in form players at the moment, regardless of recent caps and such, Arfield vs. Osorio may be a tough call. They both have similar attributes and profiles and you may only want to take one, not necessarily both. I find it very hard to see Arfield in the national team with Osorio left at home, but that may just be because Osorio has been such a big part of the national team and Arfield has basically been done since 2019. 

We all know and love Osorio, but I truly feel if they had nameless jerseys and watched the GC matches, he'd have been removed at 45 and we'd say we had seen enough.  It was really bad.  I encourage anyone that doubts that to go back and watch.

[PopePouri]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

So you take a blue cap tweet with no detail or explanation over what's actually been said in taped interviews?

I was being facetious.

[eramosat]

away for a month and somehow whatever this is a topic of frequent posting? 

Arfield for the armband next international match.